Commercial Activity

[Cet Homme Charmant]

4 hours ago, vikingTON said:

So you're claiming that there will be no streams available of Morton home games this season, to anyone who hasn't signed up for the official season ticket? 

No, I'm not claiming that at all, and never have done. Obviously, anyone can live stream the games now with an iptv app or a fire stick for next to nothing, from anywhere in the world. 

So the club are obviously trying to moniterise it by offering an alternative, better quality live stream than you get from the pixelot camera in the Cowshed. Makes perfect business sense, and I'm fairly sure most fans who can afford it will be more than happy to pay for the superior stream offered by the club (notwithstanding the recent issues which seem to have been resolved).

[TRVMP]

I'll be as neutral as I can:

If I was a total neutral with no interest in the Championship compared to any other world league, and I could watch the same or lesser standard of stream for free on a dodgy site, I'd pick the dodgy site. 

If I was a die hard fan who could pay for an online season ticket or watch the same quality stream for free, I'd pay out of loyalty. 

Needless to say I'd do the same in the current situation (pay for the good stream or get Pixellot for free.) 

If I was a partial fan of the club and could watch a bad standard of stream (Pixellot) for free occasionally, or pay for an online season ticket, I'd select Pixellot. Same if I was an away fan. 

If I was a partial fan and could go PAYG for a good stream or free for Pixellot, I'd pick and choose. 

Were I local and not overseas I would, as an admitted diehard, just go to games and would somehow get a legit stream if I couldn't but was near a phone/laptop and able to watch. 

Through all these permutations I really can't see what Morton should be doing differently here. It's very possible my view is colored massively by being an emigrant but I just can't wrap my head around the kind of person who, if able to watch football from around the world for free, would choose to watch Morton on a stream instead of Liverpool, and not just walk down the road and pay in. It would be an utterly bizarre kind of dedication to a local club that *for now* I don't think MCT needs to tackle. In the future, maybe. But for now virtually everyone of able body who wants to watch Morton knows exactly where to find them. 

[vikingTON]

19 hours ago, Cet Homme Charmant said:

No, I'm not claiming that at all, and never have done. Obviously, anyone can live stream the games now with an iptv app or a fire stick for next to nothing, from anywhere in the world. 

How can 'anyone' - including of course many of the away fans for any given Cappielow match - stream access to the game for next to nothing?

What easily removable technological feature allows this coach and horses to be run through the chief revenue-generating model for the club? 

Be extremely specific in your answer.

"So the club are obviously trying to moniterise it by offering an alternative, better quality live stream than you get from the pixelot camera in the Cowshed. Makes perfect business sense, and I'm fairly sure most fans who can afford it will be more than happy to pay for the superior stream offered by the club (notwithstanding the recent issues which seem to have been resolved)."

Well no it doesn't because

a) the 'higher quality' monetised option quite clearly wasn't actually shitting enough money to retain the original and highly commended commentary for the product, and doesn't actually work reliably. So much for 'higher quality' then, and

b) the dozens if not hundreds of Ayr, Raith, Dundee  United etc. fans who choose to watch their away game at Cappielow via a shite stream from the comfort of their home this season for zero actual pounds are really not going to feel streamers' remorse at not shelling out £22 to be at the game, or for not having access to an official stream. When the access price to an individual Pixellot stream is literally nothing, the idea that Morton's Goldilocks, 'high quality but, err, here's a refund if it completely fails again' option is fiscally prudent is for the birds.

[Cet Homme Charmant]

28 minutes ago, vikingTON said:

How can 'anyone' - including of course many of the away fans for any given Cappielow match - stream access to the game for next to nothing?

What easily removable technological feature allows this coach and horses to be run through the chief revenue-generating model for the club? 

Be extremely specific in your answer.

"So the club are obviously trying to moniterise it by offering an alternative, better quality live stream than you get from the pixelot camera in the Cowshed. Makes perfect business sense, and I'm fairly sure most fans who can afford it will be more than happy to pay for the superior stream offered by the club (notwithstanding the recent issues which seem to have been resolved)."

Well no it doesn't because

a) the 'higher quality' monetised option quite clearly wasn't actually shitting enough money to retain the original and highly commended commentary for the product, and doesn't actually work reliably. So much for 'higher quality' then, and

b) the dozens if not hundreds of Ayr, Raith, Dundee  United etc. fans who choose to watch their away game at Cappielow via a shite stream from the comfort of their home this season for zero actual pounds are really not going to feel streamers' remorse at not shelling out £22 to be at the game, or for not having access to an official stream. When the access price to an individual Pixellot stream is literally nothing, the idea that Morton's Goldilocks, 'high quality but, err, here's a refund if it completely fails again' option is fiscally prudent is for the birds.

You do know that sometimes you come across as a total dick, yeah?

OK you win, live streaming will be the death of our once proud club.

[vikingTON]

^^^ verge of tears

The Rafa Benitez approved facts that the club was literally at death's door merely 18 months ago; couldn't put a serious squad together this season until it progressed and drew a fortunately lucrative 2nd round cup draw; and still probably won't have more than 4 subs on the bench for the game tomorrow are for some reason more impressive to me than your Benelux-sized sense of entitlement.

Scotland is in the grip of an enormous crisis of falling disposable income and massive price inflation across the board. Football fans are being priced out of attending games as a result of clubs' response to their own rising costs. We'll see the reality of that tomorrow and every other week this season. Facilitating the total undercutting of the primary source of income for a football club in this environment is the height of business folly. 

And as a fan-owned club with no daft sweetie merchant backer any more, GMFC are indeed the canary in the coalmine. When the club can no longer sustain a credible first team squad, I'm sure we'll all be grateful to the overseas subs for allowing us to still afford utter dung like Stefan Milojevic mk. II in the seaside leagues again.

Edited August 11, 2023 by vikingTON

[Cet Homme Charmant]

1 minute ago, vikingTON said:

^^^ verge of tears

The Rafa Benitez approved facts that the club was literally at death's door merely 18 months ago; couldn't put a serious squad together this season until it progressed and drew a fortunately lucrative 2nd round cup draw; and still probably won't have more than 4 subs on the bench for the game tomorrow are for some reason more impressive to me than your Benelux-sized sense of entitlement.

Scotland is in the grip of an enormous crisis of falling disposable income and massive price inflation across the board. Football fans are being priced out of games as a result of clubs' rational response to their own rising costs. We'll see the reality of that tomorrow and every other week. Facilitating the total undercutting of the primary source of income for a football club in this environment is the height of business folly. 

And as a fan-owned club with no daft sweetie merchant backer, GMFC are indeed the canary in the coalmine. When the club can no longer sustain a credible first team squad, I'm sure we'll all be grateful to the overseas subs for allowing us to still afford utter dung like Stefan Milojevic mk. II in the seaside leagues again.

Not on verge if tears, I'm totally distraught and inconsolable. 

[TRVMP]

I'd actually quite like to see year-on-year comparison of away figures. Not sure if anyone even compiles that for the Championship. Streams are one variable among many - cost of living surely the greatest one - but it would be interesting to see if there was a significant decline post-streaming. The Ayr support looked normal enough.

It's surprising how well attendance has held up, given the state of the economy.

Edited August 11, 2023 by TRVMP

[vikingTON]

On 8/10/2023 at 11:42 PM, TRVMP said:

It's obviously not a direct comparison but if you want to see an industry that "leaned in" to the lack of gatekeeping online, look no further than music. They fought a rearguard action against Napster and Kazaa and the like and ended up giving away the store with Spotify, Apple Music, YouTube Music etc. Obviously this came at great cost to the labels and publ- sorry, can't finish that without laughing. Obviously this came at great cost to the artists but it had to be done.

The music industry has adapted by pivoting to an emphasis on the 'live event experience', which is why artists are constantly touring now at ever-higher prices. Although the increasing number of festivals folding due to poor ticket sales this summer suggests even that strategy is reaching its limits.

People often look sideways at the comparison with cinema or live music but that is precisely the sector that Scottish football is located within. You pay high (sometimes extortionate) entry costs, you are expected to buy crap refreshments within the venue at an enormous markup, everybody involved takes a marginal cut of your cash and then you go home satisfied or not. Those industries might well be fighting a doomed, rearguard action against the hugely disruptive alternative, but they're not actively facilitating their own downfall on the spurious grounds of 'revenue' or widening access.

[TRVMP]

11 minutes ago, vikingTON said:

The music industry has adapted by pivoting to an emphasis on the 'live event experience', which is why artists are constantly touring now at ever-higher prices. Although the increasing number of festivals folding due to poor ticket sales this summer suggests even that strategy is reaching its limits.

People often look sideways at the comparison with cinema or live music but that is precisely the sector that Scottish football is located within. You pay high (sometimes extortionate) entry costs, you are expected to buy crap refreshments within the venue at an enormous markup, everybody involved takes a marginal cut of your cash and then you go home satisfied or not. Those industries might well be fighting a doomed, rearguard action against the hugely disruptive alternative, but they're not actively facilitating their own downfall on the spurious grounds of 'revenue' or widening access.

I was considering bringing that up but decided against it because frankly it doesn't look great for us. The absolute top acts, such as Taylor Swift, can charge whatever they want. They print money. Anyone second tier is really, really struggling.

Football is definitely not exempt from broader trends in the entertainment sector, but a key difference is the emotional attachment and frequency. You may see your favorite band every time they tour to your city but that's unlikely to be more than once a year. Same for a favorite actor or director. Football has that routine aspect that both helps and hinders (helps because it's recurring and becomes a habit; hinders because if you fall out of the habit it's difficult to be lured back and absent a Cup final or promotion decider there's not a "special occasion" factor either.)

[irnbru]

8 hours ago, Cet Homme Charmant said:

You do know that sometimes you come across as a total dick, yeah?

OK you win, live streaming will be the death of our once proud club.

Sometimes? 

[Cet Homme Charmant]

12 hours ago, TRVMP said:

 It's surprising how well attendance has held up, given the state of the economy.

I was thinking the same thing. The cost-of-living crisis is bound to have had some effect on attendances, but it would appear to be negligible. Someone did mention though that hospitality was only half full for the Ayr game, so while most can still find enough attend, the 'luxuries' like hospitality may taking a back seat for some.

[Jamie_M]

12 hours ago, TRVMP said:

Football has that routine aspect that both helps and hinders (helps because it's recurring and becomes a habit; hinders because if you fall out of the habit it's difficult to be lured back and absent a Cup final or promotion decider there's not a "special occasion" factor either.)

The habit factor definitely helps and remains strong and hard to break. Surprised by how easily it returned to normal levels when the habit was force broken by covid but I guess people were so desperate for a return to normality that the opportunity to go back had an extra pull.

There are very few people not changing at least some habits in the current climate right now from food shopping to going out and holidays.

Going to the football will definitely start to come under consideration for some, especially if prices keep rising.

[Hej]

Is the company selling the 81-84 and 97-99 retro kits affiliated with the club? 

[SassenachTon]

I don't think that the music business is a particularly valid comparison, although I understand why it has been made. The whole music-industry business model has been forced into this situation because of the digital age - it's changed everything. Here's how;

1 Once upon a time, bands would spend tens of thousands on upmarket studio rentals, and spend fortunes producing an album. Those recording costs (along with the band's livelihood) were then recouped using vast numbers of physical sales (CD's, vinyl) of that album. Touring was done pretty much on a break-even basis as a marketing tool to sell more physical product. I'm sure that we all have our nerdy sides, but I still have my ticket stub from 1980 when I saw Judas Priest (supported by a new young London band called Iron Maiden) at the De Montfort Hall in Leicester. The ticket price was £2.25. I'd never heard any Iron Maiden - but I went out and bought the album the next day. QED.

2 Enter the digital age where those same albums now exist as high-quality digital files on the internet - and everyone downloads the album for free, completely obliterating the band's principal source of revenue = their music. Sure - the streaming platforms charge their subscribers to download legitimately, but they're vast corporates, and the royalties they pay are pitiful - like fractions of a penny for the download of a single. 

3 Faced with the above, bands had no alternative but to reverse the model through a complete 180-degree shift, effectively giving away their music for free, and relying on live performing as their principal income stream. Cue extortionate ticket prices, extortionate merch prices, extortionate food & drink prices etc. etc. etc. It's the only way bands can earn a living. The smaller festivals are starting to struggle because there are a) too many of them, b) because they can't afford to put big-name acts on the bill to attract decent numbers (see point 2 for why), and 3) folks would rather pay £100 to see their favourite band than pay the same to see a dozen unknown ones.

4 The digital age has also dramatically changed how albums are recorded. Gone are almost all of the swanky studios with vast SSL mixing consoles , racks of outboard equipment and megabucks analogue 24-track machines, and enter the computer loaded with recording software. It's improved, developed and price-dropped to the extent that a clued-up kid can now record a broadcast-quality album on a laptop in his bedroom. And they do. Lots of them.

I could go on - but you get the point. Fitba, however, is (and always has been, and always will be) a live spectator event. It's my opinion that if ticket prices do eventually reach a stage where attendances drop specifically though the inability of individuals to afford to go to games, then a viable streaming service is the next-best way of maintaining the club's income. We can beat our chests as much as we like, but the facts are plain for all to see.

Just my opinion.

[vikingTON]

16 hours ago, SassenachTon said:

I could go on - but you get the point. Fitba, however, is (and always has been, and always will be) a live spectator event. It's my opinion that if ticket prices do eventually reach a stage where attendances drop specifically though the inability of individuals to afford to go to games, then a viable streaming service is the next-best way of maintaining the club's income. We can beat our chests as much as we like, but the facts are plain for all to see.

Just my opinion.

What proportion of Man United fans, or Juventus fans or indeed 'Rangers' or Celtic fans regularly view their matches live and in person? If it will always be a live spectator event, then why are Inter Miami highlights from a tinpot league suddenly swamping media feeds when next to nobody is actually going to travel to Miami to watch a game? 

The football = live spectator event model is nowhere near as secure now as you claim. There is no reason to assume that it will survive further undermining of that idea without undergoing a complete collapse in the lower levels at least. 

As for your sustaining revenue by streaming argument - there's no credible model for doing so. GMFC or any other Championship club have a fairly inelastic group of customers - there are not hundreds of millions of people in SE Asia wearing Robbie Crawford jerseys on Saturday nights (although they really should). So if the revenue generated by customer drops by half or even more - bearing in mind that the current market price for streaming a game is zero - then you need double the customer base to avoid losing money overall. It's as unworkable a model as when Albion Rovers or other have tried chucking open the gates for spectators to donate their entrance money - the numbers simply do not add up. 

It's quite possible that the numbers won't add up in the near future in any case - but a football club would be beyond stupid to directly facilitate that outcome.

[Mr.Blue]

Email from Ross to say the Chevrons are available for pick up.

Top is a cracker.

[SassenachTon]

@vikingTON  All fair points, and well made. The only thing I'd take issue with is that I didn't say that revenue from gate receipts alone was sustainable - I made the point that if they continue rising to a level where folks can't afford to go, then they won't. Morton (along with all other clubs either at our level or lower) have to find an alternative method of staying afloat, whatever that method is. Me? I've no idea what.

[Greacen2000]

On 8/12/2023 at 8:49 PM, Hej said:

Is the company selling the 81-84 and 97-99 retro kits affiliated with the club? 

As far as I can see they aren’t official colabs with Umbro or Avec so I seriously doubt the club would get involved in bootleg/unofficial replica merch, given the possible legal implications etc.

The tops both look like absolute crackers but given that are only being made in very limited numbers, I don’t see them as being a major threat to sales of our official shirts so my guess is that the club are ok with turning a blind eye to it.  It’s pretty harmless and gives fans a chance to get their hands on an approximation of some sought after rare kits

Edited August 15, 2023 by Greacen2000

[Ray Von]

Retro top a bit of a shambles whoever is organising it. 
They took £53.99 from me in May because I had paid for delivery, I got £53.99 refunded in June, now I’ve got an email to go and collect it at Cappielow and find a different way to pay for it. 
Obviously I choose to get it delivered because it isn’t convenient to get to Cappielow.

[bob_the_builder]

3 hours ago, Ray Von said:

Retro top a bit of a shambles whoever is organising it. 
They took £53.99 from me in May because I had paid for delivery, I got £53.99 refunded in June, now I’ve got an email to go and collect it at Cappielow and find a different way to pay for it. 
Obviously I choose to get it delivered because it isn’t convenient to get to Cappielow.

They finally took the £53.99 payment from me yesterday and sent an email to confirm this but nothing about whether it’s been shipped. I’ve had to download the Shop app which tells it’s been shipped so fingers crossed I’ll get it this week.

You’re right it’s been an utter shambles but I’ve not made a big fuss about it as I’d technically not paid for anything. However they have my money so they’d better get it to me asap.