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#1 HamCam

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Posted 01 February 2020 - 09:49 AM

Was there enough there that he could have left a legacy of Morton with no debt?

https://www.scotsman...-will-1-5083777
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#2 LargsTON

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Posted 01 February 2020 - 10:55 AM

Absolutely.
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#3 Jamie_M

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Posted 01 February 2020 - 10:59 AM

Was there enough there that he could have left a legacy of Morton with no debt?

https://www.scotsman...-will-1-5083777


That could, should and was supposed to happen, even if there was nothing there.
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#4 capitanus

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Posted 01 February 2020 - 11:34 AM

I have no doubt that this was the intentions of Mr Rae, however a poor combination of poor estate planning, lack of a credible succession plan plus greed of the family have contrived to leave Morton in a perilous financial position, and ruin the legacy which their father left.

The MCT scheme is something that should never have been. I have no doubt that DDFR would be turning in his grave at what has become of his club and his family, and to know that rather than being seen as the salvation of the club, he is effectively seen as the architect of its demise.
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#5 HamCam

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Posted 01 February 2020 - 12:31 PM

I have no doubt that this was the intentions of Mr Rae, however a poor combination of poor estate planning, lack of a credible succession plan plus greed of the family have contrived to leave Morton in a perilous financial position, and ruin the legacy which their father left.

The MCT scheme is something that should never have been. I have no doubt that DDFR would be turning in his grave at what has become of his club and his family, and to know that rather than being seen as the salvation of the club, he is effectively seen as the architect of its demise.


Not convinced. If DDFR wanted to leave the club debt free it would have been explicit in the will.
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#6 TheGoon

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Posted 01 February 2020 - 12:54 PM

Yeah, and even before his death (years before) that feels like something that could’ve/should’ve been communicated were it the case.
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#7 irnbru

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Posted 01 February 2020 - 01:28 PM

Not convinced. If DDFR wanted to leave the club debt free it would have been explicit in the will.


I don't think he saw it as a debt or problem.
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#8 vikingTON

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Posted 01 February 2020 - 01:36 PM

I don't think he saw it as a debt or problem.


Douglas Rae is on record as stating that the debt would have to be paid back if someone tried to buy the club (April 2014) so what you ‘think’ about this matter is irrelevant.

He also had more time and incentive combined than just about anyone to plan for his succession. This current mess was his responsibility then.
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The site is supposed to be a place for the extended 'family' of Morton supporters - having an affinity with people that you don't know, because you share a love of your local football club. It's not supposed to be about point scoring and showing how 'clever' or 'funny' you are, or just being downright rude and offensive to people you don't know, because you can get away with it. Unfortunately, it seems the classic case of people who have little standing/presence in real life, use this forum as a way of making themselves feel as if they are something. It's sad, and I've said that before..

So, having been on Morton forums for about 15 years I guess, I've had enough... well done t*ssers, another Morton supporter driven away. You can all feel happy at how 'clever' you are


#9 Ton4life

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Posted 01 February 2020 - 01:36 PM

Probably a bit more complicated that as seems on the surface.

He used Golden Casket as the funding agent who would have used this as a tax avoidance scheme.

He likely not have thought this through as he would seen the family taking over the business/Ton support.

Yes the MCT scheme is their best bet for getting some returns on the loans.
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#10 irnbru

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Posted 01 February 2020 - 01:43 PM

Probably a bit more complicated that as seems on the surface.

He used Golden Casket as the funding agent who would have used this as a tax avoidance scheme.

He likely not have thought this through as he would seen the family taking over the business/Ton support.

Yes the MCT scheme is their best bet for getting some returns on the loans.


What returns will they get from MCT?
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#11 HamCam

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Posted 01 February 2020 - 01:53 PM

I don't think he saw it as a debt or problem.


If that was the case, he was probably incapable of changing the will! The debt is the problem and the club has been left to deal with it.
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#12 vikingTON

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Posted 01 February 2020 - 03:39 PM

*
POPULAR

Probably a bit more complicated that as seems on the surface.

He used Golden Casket as the funding agent who would have used this as a tax avoidance scheme.

He likely not have thought this through as he would seen the family taking over the business/Ton support.

Yes the MCT scheme is their best bet for getting some returns on the loans.

Douglas Rae knew his family better than anyone else would have done. He was also a successful businessman who clearly had a grasp of such things as investment, risk and future planning while building up GC. He was also involved with Morton in a director capacity from at least the mid 1990s. This wasn’t some fat loser Euromillions winner who just rocked up at a football club for a laugh then, so the idea that he was unable to determine or was misled by his moustache-twirling sprogs about what would happen when he was gone is pish. Convenient, wishful thinking pish as it divides the ‘good’ Dougie who saved the club from his ‘bad’ successors, but pish nonetheless.

This club’s predicament since May 2018 is as much Douglas Rae’s legacy as taking the club out of administration in the first place.

Edited by vikingTON, 01 February 2020 - 03:40 PM.

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The site is supposed to be a place for the extended 'family' of Morton supporters - having an affinity with people that you don't know, because you share a love of your local football club. It's not supposed to be about point scoring and showing how 'clever' or 'funny' you are, or just being downright rude and offensive to people you don't know, because you can get away with it. Unfortunately, it seems the classic case of people who have little standing/presence in real life, use this forum as a way of making themselves feel as if they are something. It's sad, and I've said that before..

So, having been on Morton forums for about 15 years I guess, I've had enough... well done t*ssers, another Morton supporter driven away. You can all feel happy at how 'clever' you are


#13 LargsTON

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Posted 01 February 2020 - 03:54 PM

Douglas Rae knew his family better than anyone else would have done. He was also a successful businessman who clearly had a grasp of such things as investment, risk and future planning while building up GC. He was also involved with Morton in a director capacity from at least the mid 1990s. This wasn’t some fat loser Euromillions winner who just rocked up at a football club for a laugh then, so the idea that he was unable to determine or was misled by his moustache-twirling sprogs about what would happen when he was gone is pish. Convenient, wishful thinking pish as it divides the ‘good’ Dougie who saved the club from his ‘bad’ successors, but pish nonetheless.

This club’s predicament since May 2018 is as much Douglas Rae’s legacy as taking the club out of administration in the first place.


Sounds harsh but totally agree.
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#14 capitanus

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Posted 01 February 2020 - 09:20 PM

If that was the case, he was probably incapable of changing the will! The debt is the problem and the club has been left to deal with it.


The clubs supporters have been left to deal with it.
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#15 capitanus

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Posted 02 February 2020 - 02:24 AM

The more I think about it, the more I am convinced that the figurehead for MCT who appeared out of nowhere is actually a stooge for the club, a 'useful idiot' if you will, and this whole 'ivry buddy chips in munny' thing is actually a scheme designed to enable the Rae Family (or Mrs Rae in particular, as she is effectively the heritable proprietor) to abdicate their responsibilities associated with ownership.

This issue about the clubs ownership is going to get even messier before it gets sorted out.
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#16 9 Strathblane Crescent

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Posted 03 February 2020 - 12:33 PM

Douglas Rae wrote off £515,516 of Morton's debt in in the clubs accounts year ending 31st May 2016.

 

But for Crawford Douglas Rae would have written off ALL the debt that year.

 

Douglas Rae wanted to leave the club debt free before he passed away. Maybe that was the legacy he wanted to leave after all.

 

Obviously Crawford couldn't stomach losing all that money in the one go in the forlorn hope that he could claw some of it back in the future. But even he now realises that it's never going to happen hence his willingness to write it off if he gets a reasonable offer for the club.


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#17 HamCam

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Posted 03 February 2020 - 05:24 PM

At the time the words used were "partially forgive the debt"; a debt entirely down to DDFR's stewardship of the club. Don't get me wrong, I have always accepted DDFR acted with the best intentions but at the same time, we are where we are because he wanted to play football manager and no-one on the Board had the balls to challenge how this played out in the accounts. I also still maintain if DDFR wanted to leave the club debt-free it would have been written into the will. 


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#18 vikingTON

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Posted 03 February 2020 - 06:09 PM

Douglas Rae wrote off £515,516 of Morton's debt in in the clubs accounts year ending 31st May 2016.

But for Crawford Douglas Rae would have written off ALL the debt that year.

Douglas Rae wanted to leave the club debt free before he passed away. Maybe that was the legacy he wanted to leave after all.


If only there was some legally binding document that people use all the time to set out their wishes and ‘legacy’ on passing away that we can examine here; as opposed to bullshit lines fed to gormless, wannabe flunkies like yourself in the Gamble Halls.

Edited by vikingTON, 03 February 2020 - 06:10 PM.

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The site is supposed to be a place for the extended 'family' of Morton supporters - having an affinity with people that you don't know, because you share a love of your local football club. It's not supposed to be about point scoring and showing how 'clever' or 'funny' you are, or just being downright rude and offensive to people you don't know, because you can get away with it. Unfortunately, it seems the classic case of people who have little standing/presence in real life, use this forum as a way of making themselves feel as if they are something. It's sad, and I've said that before..

So, having been on Morton forums for about 15 years I guess, I've had enough... well done t*ssers, another Morton supporter driven away. You can all feel happy at how 'clever' you are


#19 9 Strathblane Crescent

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Posted 03 February 2020 - 07:26 PM

If only there was some legally binding document that people use all the time to set out their wishes and ‘legacy’ on passing away that we can examine here; as opposed to bullshit lines fed to gormless, wannabe flunkies like yourself in the Gamble Halls.

Your such a pathetic little boy..... The statement I made came straight from the horses mouth and had nothing to do with the Gamble Hall meeting. I'll say it again Crawford Rae put pressure on his father not to clear off all the debt.


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#20 HamCam

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Posted 03 February 2020 - 09:06 PM

Your such a pathetic little boy..... The statement I made came straight from the horses mouth and had nothing to do with the Gamble Hall meeting. I'll say it again Crawford Rae put pressure on his father not to clear off all the debt.

As you appear to know the man better than most, do you think Crawford genuinely thought he would get all or some of the debt back from a buyer? Morton has hemorrhaged cash since his dad took on the club.  


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