English Premier League spying on football supporters

[capitanus]

 

Shocking.  This must be resisted.

 

Discuss.

[SassenachTon]

That's truly scary stuff. And she seems like such a genuinely nice person, too. To me - taking the knee represented nothing more than hollow virtue-signalling. It didn't actually stop anything which was going on. The world has now sadly become dominated by people who are offended at absolutely anything and everything. It's insidious and alarming to me, for example, that virtually every advertisement and every TV show now seemingly has to feature the obligatory token Asian person, the obligatory token gay couple, the obligatory token black person, the obligatory token mixed-race couple, the obligatory token disabled person - the list is endless. Such inclusion is of course completely laudable, but I believe that the level to which it's being taken is grossly disproportionate, simply because broadcasters daren't have it any other way for fear of bad press and non-woke accusations. I don't have a prejudiced, racist or homophobic bone in my body (just like the vast majority of us, I'm sure) - but this agenda is being rammed down our throats on a daily basis, with our entire corporate world having become scared shitless just in case they aren't seen to be doing the right thing - including this. The UK is an incredibly diverse place and is all the more richer for it in so many ways. I honestly worry about how much further all this is going to go, and how long it will be before this apparent policing of everything a citizen does and says will render us speechless, because we're frightened of saying something which someone will be offended by.

I've been walking on eggshells whilst writing this, constantly going back editing bits just in case I've said anything which could possibly be misconstrued by anyone. I hope not. I even spent time deliberating whether or not it was acceptable to say 'black person'.

These are the times we now live in. There's no turning back from this.

Edited February 4 by SassenachTon

[capitanus]

I dont disagree with any of what SassenachTon has said above, however it is taking it off on a bit of a tangent.  I've nothing against fairness and equality shown to people with disabilities; people of different ethnic backgrounds; or fairness shown to Gay/Bi/Lesbian people too.  Lets face it, it takes all sorts to make a world.  However, thats not really what this is about.

This was a young woman who identifies as a Lesbian stating a legitimate fact - a Transexual Woman isn't a Woman - and she has suffered invasive harrassment from her favourite football club and the league, and has now been banned from attending Newcastle's games for several years a result of this fact-based opinion.

That is just fundamentally wrong.

There are so many different elements which 'attach' themselves to football across the country, for example, every club has 'casual' groups; there is no shortage of right-wing or left-wing agendists using football as a vehicle; there is open support for paramilitary terror groups in stadiums across the country; there is racism, religious prejudice and a whole lot more going on - so why are they putting so much resources and effort into persecuting one woman with a perfectly understandable opinions on her own social media?

I've lost a lot of respect for Newcastle over this.

[SassenachTon]

Agreed, Cap’n. It seems like this story represents a completely OTT, knee-jerk reaction from Newcastle to appease what they obviously consider to be some kind of invisible minority, and to publicly make some kind of virtue-signalling stand to prove how right-on they are.  It will be interesting to follow the story and to see how it pans out - and more to the point, to see how Newcastle react to this. I’m sure they’ve seen the video, and I’m equally sure that there’s probably some squirming going on at the fact that this is potentially going to blow up in their face. 

I’m guessing that Linzi has acquired her ‘dossier’ under the Data Protection Act. The contents of that are mind-blowingly intimidating. I wonder how legal all of that data collection was? All the lassie’s done is to state a biological fact. Whether or not that was a sensible thing to do in the current climate is another matter - but she’s not committed any crime. I hope that this gets resolved in some way, and that the perpetrators end up with a hefty dose of egg on their faces.

 

[Cet Homme Charmant]

13 hours ago, SassenachTon said:

 It's insidious and alarming to me, for example, that virtually every advertisement and every TV show now seemingly has to feature the obligatory token Asian person, the obligatory token gay couple, the obligatory token black person, the obligatory token mixed-race couple, the obligatory token disabled person - the list is endless. 

So what you're basically saying is that Asian, gay, black, mixed-race and disabled should not be represented in advertisements and TV shows, and only white, straight, fully able-bodied people should be on your telly.

Guess what... Asian, gay, black, mixed-race and disabled are all real people who live in society, and to exclude them as you're suggesting is just ludicrous, sorry. That's not 'tokenism', it's simply reflecting reality.

I always had you down as one of the good guys, sorry to discover your sinister hidden prejudices.

[SassenachTon]

3 hours ago, Cet Homme Charmant said:

So what you're basically saying is that Asian, gay, black, mixed-race and disabled should not be represented in advertisements and TV shows, and only white, straight, fully able-bodied people should be on your telly.

Guess what... Asian, gay, black, mixed-race and disabled are all real people who live in society, and to exclude them as you're suggesting is just ludicrous, sorry. That's not 'tokenism', it's simply reflecting reality.

I always had you down as one of the good guys, sorry to discover your sinister hidden prejudices.

That’s completely unfair, CHC, and absolutely the polar opposite of what I tried to convey whilst compiling my walking-on-eggshells post. I went to lengths truthfully portraying myself as being completely devoid of any form of prejudice whatsoever, describing the inclusion policy of broadcasters as completely laudable. My point revolved solely around the reasons why they feel so pressured into doing this. I furthermore celebrated the diverse, multi-cultural aspect of our society and stated clearly and honestly how much richer I feel we’ve become as a result. This kind of response perfectly illustrates how sincere, innocent words can be misconstrued (despite being clearly qualified and placed against a specific backdrop) and also exemplifies how so much can be taken so badly out of context - and in that respect, I can only offer you the very sincerest of apologies. I tried so hard not to offend anyone. I clearly didn’t try hard enough. Since you’ve publicly branded me as the forum’s resident ‘sinister’ bigot, however,  I don’t think that any further contributions from me in this minefield would be appropriate.

As I said - fear will ultimately render us speechless.

Edited February 5 by SassenachTon

[Cet Homme Charmant]

2 hours ago, SassenachTon said:

That’s completely unfair, CHC, and absolutely the polar opposite of what I tried to convey whilst compiling my walking-on-eggshells post. I went to lengths truthfully portraying myself as being completely devoid of any form of prejudice whatsoever, describing the inclusion policy of broadcasters as completely laudable. My point revolved solely around the reasons why they feel so pressured into doing this. I furthermore celebrated the diverse, multi-cultural aspect of our society and stated clearly and honestly how much richer I feel we’ve become as a result. This kind of response perfectly illustrates how sincere, innocent words can be misconstrued (despite being clearly qualified and placed against a specific backdrop) and also exemplifies how so much can be taken so badly out of context - and in that respect, I can only offer you the very sincerest of apologies. I tried so hard not to offend anyone. I clearly didn’t try hard enough. Since you’ve publicly branded me as the forum’s resident ‘sinister’ bigot, however,  I don’t think that any further contributions from me in this minefield would be appropriate.

As I said - fear will ultimately render us speechless.

And yet you specifically said that including Asian, black, gay, mixed-race and disabled people in adverts and and 'every TV show' alarmed you. You said including these people was tokenism. It's your own words, so not unfair at all.

Edited February 5 by Cet Homme Charmant

[Cappiecat 1.2]

It's fucking hilarious when these thin skinned, narrow minded reactionary types go the Internet wailing and crying to vent their spleen about 'woke culture' and 'snowflakes' ruining society. They seem to get upset about how many brown/gay/disabled/trans people there are in TV, film, music etc. Is there a quota for minority representation in popular culture, which when breached sets off their tears and snotters? Ridiculous people.

3 minutes of the eejit in the video was enough, so I read about the epl story instead. Snooping on paying customers and banning them for their personal opinions is a horrendous scenario and needs to be put in the sea.

[Cet Homme Charmant]

Well indeed. Any able-bodied white heterosexual who's genuinely 'alarmed' by the portrayal of disabled, black, Asian and mixed-race people on the telly really should be confined to the dark ages where they belong. The people they're so alarmed about are every bit as much a part of society are they are, and have an equal right of representation.

 

[capitanus]

As I said above, SassenachTon's comments were taking it off on a different tangent, and not quite what this was all about.  As for CHC, if there was someone on this board that was going to be first with the 'Bah! You're Racist' wagging finger, I could have bet my mortgage on it being Bridget from Flanders.

Anyway,

As I said previously i've not really got an issue with fairness and equality being shown to people that wouldn't otherwise be given a chance, whether its people from different ethnic backgrounds, people with disabilities etc.  However I can appreciate that SassenachTon may be from an older generation and perhaps is witnessing it all swinging too far in the opposite direction.  CHC may be a bit oblivious considering he's based in Holland/Belgium, but many BBC Shows nowadays look like a box-ticking exercise where there needs to be 'diversity' on show for the sake of it.  Its even the case in BBC Scotland, and why Leanne Crichton seems to be on every football programme, and its questionable whether that 'Thommo' character would have got the main host role on Sportscene if he were heterosexual too.

Anyway,

Back to the main point.  I'd be interested to see how 'run of the mill' Newcastle supporters react to this.  Will there be protests?  Will the Linzi girl become some kind of cause celebre which will lead to them winding their necks in, big time?

It also reminds me of the time that Hawke the Cock started sending letters out to Morton supporters about their conduct with no good reason.  I can imagine to someone other than the actual recipients at the time those could have been intimidating.  However the Newcastle thing is so much more sinister than that.  The club and the league have gone too far.

Edited February 5 by capitanus

[Cappiecat 1.2]

The Newcastle fan had posted that women don't have cocks, or something similar. Newcastle FC have banned her for making anti trans statements. The same Newcastle that are owned by members of the murderous Saudi ruling dynasty. I guess Saudi Arabia must be very tolerant in their laws regarding gay and trans people now?

The hypocrisy is off the fucking scale here.

[Cet Homme Charmant]

7 hours ago, capitanus said:

As for CHC, if there was someone on this board that was going to be first with the 'Bah! You're Racist' wagging finger 

Well I didn't actually call him that, but people can draw that own conclusions on someone when they say they're 'alarmed' when they see an Asian, black, gay, mixed-race or disable person on the telly. 

[SassenachTon]

8 hours ago, Cet Homme Charmant said:

Well I didn't actually call him that, but people can draw that own conclusions on someone when they say they're 'alarmed' when they see an Asian, black, gay, mixed-race or disable person on the telly. 

I didn’t say that, not even close. Read my posts again. Any alarm raised was centred solely around broadcasters feeling pressured into obligatory positive discrimination. I was tempted to PM you and tell you about my colour, my ongoing progressive disability, and something else too, after you’d blindly jumped in with both feet and tagged me as white, able-bodied and heterosexual. But I decided not to since I can’t prove it to you without sending you photos and medical records. No minor forum tiff is worth that. I know I said I wouldn’t contribute further, but I’ve been very badly misunderstood and unfairly misrepresented here. I just want folks to know that.

 

[Cet Homme Charmant]

26 minutes ago, SassenachTon said:

I didn’t say that, not even close.  

This is what you said....

It's insidious and alarming to me, for example, that virtually every advertisement and every TV show now seemingly has to feature the obligatory token Asian person, the obligatory token gay couple, the obligatory token black person, the obligatory token mixed-race couple, the obligatory token disabled person - the list is endless.

So you did say it. It's there in black and white. 

How do you decide when any of the people you are so alarmed by are there for tokenism, rather than simply because of normal and natural inclusiveness to reflect the diversity of society as a whole?

You can look at it both ways. In dramas set in London or many other of the major cities in the UK, of course you're going to have many of the people you describe, for no other reason than a large percentage of the population there include these minorities. Similarly, in dramas like Shetland and Happy Valley, set either in remote or (semi) rural locations, the cast are obviously going to be predominantly white, to reflect the realities of these societies. 

Bear in mind also that the industry that you are accusing of tokenism by including the people you mentioned, is still overwhelmingly ran by white males. 

I've got absolutely nothing against you personally, and I'm genuinely sorry to hear you have health issues, and for these I wish you all the best. But that doesn't give you the right to write stuff like that and not be challenged. 

 

 

Edited February 6 by Cet Homme Charmant

[SassenachTon]

On 2/4/2024 at 9:22 PM, SassenachTon said:

Such inclusion is of course completely laudable, but I believe that the level to which it's being taken is grossly disproportionate, simply because broadcasters daren't have it any other way for fear of bad press and non-woke accusations. I don't have a prejudiced, racist or homophobic bone in my body (just like the vast majority of us, I'm sure) - but this agenda is being rammed down our throats on a daily basis, with our entire corporate world having become scared shitless just in case they aren't seen to be doing the right thing.

@Cet Homme Charmant What a shame you forgot to include the rest of the sentence.

But fair enough - I take your point. Mea Culpa.

Edited February 6 by SassenachTon

[capitanus]

10 hours ago, Cet Homme Charmant said:

Well I didn't actually call him that, but people can draw that own conclusions on someone when they say they're 'alarmed' when they see an Asian, black, gay, mixed-race or disable person on the telly. 

Well, he did say they were 'ramming it down his throat' on a daily basis, which if this is the case I can understand him being alarmed.  

[Cet Homme Charmant]

Anyway, back to the original post, if what's claimed in the video is true, it's of course an outrage

 

[capitanus]

See her interview with Sir Nigel Farage here:

 

[capitanus]

What this highlights is just how aggressive the pro-Transsexual element in this country have become, and how they pursue people who dont agree with their warped opinions. 

Graham Linehan, writer of Father Ted had a horrendous time from those bastards as a result of simply stating fact based opinions.

[Cet Homme Charmant]

On 2/6/2024 at 7:08 PM, Cet Homme Charmant said:

Anyway, back to the original post, if what's claimed in the video is true, it's of course an outrage

The reason for saying 'if true' is because of course you need to hear all sides of the argument before you can make a balanced judgement.

It's not clear from the video if Newcastle and the Premier League had been asked to comment and give their side of the story as to why this lady has been banned. If they hadn't been asked, then of course that's an obvious omission and leaves the open question as to why they didn't do so. If, on the other hand, they had been asked and they refused to give an explanation, then that casts even more doubt and suspicion on them. 

Obviously, the Premier League cannot be monitoring the social media output of every fan who attends the games. Even if they wanted to, the resources required to do that would be enormous. If we can assume that they're not, then it's also logical to assume this lady was specifically investigated for a reason. Of course that doesn't necessarily mean she's done anything wrong, it could easily have been a malicious or vacuous complaint that led to her being investigated. But, unfortunately, they did not show us the social media posts that led to her ban. If they're as innocuous as they claim, then of course it's outrageous that she has been banned. But the fact they they didn't show them could perhaps suggest there was a bit more to them than they're letting on. And Toby Young does have a bit of form when it comes to spreading misinformation.

But, like I said, if what's claimed in the video is true, then this lady has undoubtedly been treated abysmally, and almost certainly illegally, in which case, she'd probably have a very strong case if she decided to take Newcastle and the Premier League to court for damages. I'm sure there would be plenty of lawyers out there willing to take it on in a pro bono no-win, no-fee basis.

 

Edited February 8 by Cet Homme Charmant