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vikingTON

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8 hours ago, dunning1874 said:

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Outstanding behaviour.

And he's 100% right, and Trump's continuation of the Latin American meddling that has been an absolute constant in US politics for well over a century is one of the few black marks in an otherwise positive foreign policy.

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2 hours ago, TRVMP said:

I recall vividly your saying that you had little interest in domestic US affairs and were instead concerned that Trump's maverick style and lack of care and attention meant that he threatened the geopolitical world order, even world peace itself. Yet in reality Trump's foreign policy has been restrained and largely successful. He's the first President since people wore top hats not to start a new military engagement. He's negotiated in good faith with Mexico, who in turn have contributed to the security of North America by enforcing first-safe-harbor asylum law and cutting by 80% the meat grinder migratory routes. He's contributed greatly to normalization of Israeli relations with several Middle Eastern states.

Now, I regard most of the above as less - far, far less - important than domestic policy. I don't really care much about the Middle East, for example. But remember, this was your justification for being worried about his administration (and it wasn't exactly an unreasonable one), that he'd be a nutter on the world stage and place the planet under threat. Not only has this not happened, but the exact opposite has happened.

So that's why I don't really care about Tweets. You buy the meat, you get the sauce. You get the Trump who's worked hand in hand with AMLO and you also get the guy firing off nutty conspiracy theories at 4am. I'll take this over cold-eyed, ultra-professional people like Clinton and Buttigieg every single day of the year.

The part about his American domestic policy is spot on, I have next to zero interest in that. The part about his global influence however I think you've either recalled incorrectly or misinterpreted (straw man alert!). I don't think I ever predicted Trump would bring about Armageddon. My concerns were specifically about the effect his environmental policies would have on the planet, and his denial of the human influence on global warming and the withdrawal from the Paris Agreement on Climate Change would seem to have borne out these concerns.

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You are misremembering and I'm not attacking a straw man. Your very first post on the thread was about the nuclear button, not the "Paris Accords." Apparently Trump was going to flip his shit if a global leader wronged him. (In reality he was far too supine.)

 

 

The Paris Accords are a joke, with no enforcement mechanism. Anything to reduce these ridiculous junkets where we pretend that "Guinea Bissau" updating a spreadsheet is going to make a dent is fine with me. With that said, I think the climate "debate" in the US is a joke as well, and the Republicans (and Trump) are unfortunately more responsible for that than anyone else. There is no pretending this is a non-issue. But there's also no pretending that toothless checkpoints and airy-fairy pledges are going to do anything against the raw need of politicians to deliver economic growth to their countries.

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28 minutes ago, TRVMP said:

You are misremembering and I'm not attacking a straw man. Your very first post on the thread was about the nuclear button, not the "Paris Accords." Apparently Trump was going to flip his shit if a global leader wronged him. (In reality he was far too supine.)

 

 

The Paris Accords are a joke, with no enforcement mechanism. Anything to reduce these ridiculous junkets where we pretend that "Guinea Bissau" updating a spreadsheet is going to make a dent is fine with me. With that said, I think the climate "debate" in the US is a joke as well, and the Republicans (and Trump) are unfortunately more responsible for that than anyone else. There is no pretending this is a non-issue. But there's also no pretending that toothless checkpoints and airy-fairy pledges are going to do anything against the raw need of politicians to deliver economic growth to their countries.

Fair dos. 

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Once the focus on Trump losing shifts to Biden winning I think he has the potential to be a better President than he was a candidate (though his election strategy was pretty smart). He’s standing on probably the most progressive platform of any Democrat in my lifetime (or at least since I was able to make sense of politics) having worked with Sanders on a joint policy platform. The question will be how much room he has to legislate for it without the Senate or circumvent through executive orders against a 6-3 Court. 

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2 minutes ago, cmdc said:

Once the focus on Trump losing shifts to Biden winning I think he has the potential to be a better President than he was a candidate (though his election strategy was pretty smart). He’s standing on probably the most progressive platform of any Democrat in my lifetime (or at least since I was able to make sense of politics) having worked with Sanders on a joint policy platform. The question will be how much room he has to legislate for it without the Senate or circumvent through executive orders against a 6-3 Court. 

His election strategy was very smart - and it's also why despite my misgivings about him as a candidate (he's essentially the Senator for Mastercard) I didn't regard him as weak. People point to his poor finishes in the early primaries but they tend to underplay his comparatively excellent showings elsewhere, not least South Carolina.

He was often lampooned (often quite well) for living in his basement during much of the campaign, but really, why shouldn't he? He's not going to get the oxygen anyway. He just has to avoid too many mistakes. Hillary also tried to run out the clock but on the rare occasions she did surface, she couldn't stop herself from saying something truly artless. Meanwhile a few short clips of Biden stumbling over his words aside - and we do need to acknowledge that he's cognitively diminished, by the way* - he really didn't perform that badly, and generally had a reassuring presence. This won over a lot of the would-be swamp-drainers of 2016. At a time when the Iron Range in Minnesota went Trump, a lot of other midwesterners returned home to the Democratic Party, because unlike Hillary - who clearly hates anyone who's ever held a wrench or worried about a mortgage - Biden doesn't radiate unpleasantness.

Biden is being pulled from pillar to post by the establishment and left wings of his party. One of the funny things right now is that there is virtually no diversity of thought among the Republican base, 90%+ of whom are all-in on Trumpism (the remaining 10% all have NYT columns.) The Democratic Party, on the other hand, is seeing real fault lines at the activist and organizational level. If Biden and his staff can navigate those he has a chance. I actually think intra-party dealings will be as difficult as anything in the Senate.

*I'm not going to suggest dementia. I am going to point out the obvious and undeniable fact that top-level politics in the US is a gerontocracy, and Biden is two or three steps behind where he once was. Trump is one step behind where he once was, as is Nancy Pelosi. The Boomers and Silents are holding on to power for dear life, and given that the last two years of Reagan's term were probably colored by dementia, we need to reckon with the fact that eventually this is also going to occur for a top-level player in the here and now. And it could in the future - not now - be Biden.

 

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As a slight change of gear, the media's sudden, panic-induced refusal to declare *any new state* for Biden when you could have stuck a fork in a couple of them hours ago is hilarious. Not least given that Fox called Arizona on a much less secure basis to the ire of its own pundits. 

 

The site is supposed to be a place for the extended 'family' of Morton supporters - having an affinity with people that you don't know, because you share a love of your local football club. It's not supposed to be about point scoring and showing how 'clever' or 'funny' you are, or just being downright rude and offensive to people you don't know, because you can get away with it. Unfortunately, it seems the classic case of people who have little standing/presence in real life, use this forum as a way of making themselves feel as if they are something. It's sad, and I've said that before..

 

So, having been on Morton forums for about 15 years I guess, I've had enough... well done t*ssers, another Morton supporter driven away. You can all feel happy at how 'clever' you are

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38 minutes ago, vikingTON said:

As a slight change of gear, the media's sudden, panic-induced refusal to declare *any new state* for Biden when you could have stuck a fork in a couple of them hours ago is hilarious. Not least given that Fox called Arizona on a much less secure basis to the ire of its own pundits. 

 

That it's the media's "job" to call states is another significant flaw in federal elections. It's inherently unstable. A developed country should have the ability to tabulate votes on a same-day basis, and the results promulgated by the Secretary of State for each state immediately after. 

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Don't disagree at all but that they now seem to be huddling together to prepare a group intervention in the Oval Office is still amusing to watch from afar. 

The site is supposed to be a place for the extended 'family' of Morton supporters - having an affinity with people that you don't know, because you share a love of your local football club. It's not supposed to be about point scoring and showing how 'clever' or 'funny' you are, or just being downright rude and offensive to people you don't know, because you can get away with it. Unfortunately, it seems the classic case of people who have little standing/presence in real life, use this forum as a way of making themselves feel as if they are something. It's sad, and I've said that before..

 

So, having been on Morton forums for about 15 years I guess, I've had enough... well done t*ssers, another Morton supporter driven away. You can all feel happy at how 'clever' you are

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So for those keeping score at home, we've gone from:

Trump is commanding his "Proud Boys" Sturmabteilung to violently take to the streets 

to

The Left hasn't killed anyone yet this month and plus a lot of them are peaceful and joyful anyway

In other words, we've gone to the exact status quo, exactly as I said we would. 

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5 hours ago, cmdc said:

These legal challenges are...interesting. About as close to an abuse of process as you can get, which was Trump’s MO in Scotland. And the lawyers!

I agree. If hypothetically all of these cases were being filed by the same person in the same jurisdiction, they wouldn't be far off vexatious litigant status.

Some people are saying that these lawsuits, being mainly filed by unconnected groups without standing and not by the administration or the campaign itself, are merely a tactic to buy time before the Double Secret Probation lawsuits are launched. This strikes me as absurdly optimistic.

I also note that 99% (no exaggeration) of people who are losing their shit over this were either cheering on the worst excesses of the Russiagate "investigation" or thought it was a perfectly normal course of enquiry.

This is how it works from now on. I applaud any and all attempts from the Trump campaign to fight dirty (within the law, naturally), since they were given absolutely no quarter when the tables were turned.

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Ahhhh.....so much to discuss about Donald "he's picking on me, so I will disgrace him" Trump, and the damage he's done to our country and its reputation (not to say it was the best to begin with), as well as our alliances and friendships with other countries.

When this all kicked off in 2016, I predicted that Trump would be impeached, which I was right, but I was wrong in that he would be removed. I never thought that the entire right would fall in lock-step behind him. I also predicted that he would put federal forces in the streets, and that he would challenge a loss in the 2020 election (again I was right), and that he will do everything he can to stay in power, including instilling martial law (which remains to be seen...thankfully, though, the military has stated that they will not respond to martial law by following those orders).

So, here's my prediction for Trump for after noon on 20 Jan 2021.....he may give himself a pardon (which is illegal, but which the republicans won't do anything about), and he'll pardon his kids, other family members, and those closest to him at the last minute. Even if those pardons stick, they're only for federal charges. Those pardons will have NO effect on state-level charges. Thus, look for Trump, his family members, and those he pardoned to be indicted on charges in (at least) the state of New York (if not also New Jersey, Connecticut and Pennsylvania....at least). Also, him being in Mar-a-Lago in Florida (which he went to before Christmas, and which he'll never return to DC from) will have no bearing on the indictments since Trump and his ilk can be extradited from Florida to New York.

I cannot wait until Biden is sworn in. I'm an independent that has voted for both sides and independents, and I like and dislike positions from both sides (although I don't see much from the right at the moment that I can support, but I believe that once Senator McConnel is gone, that will change.

Just my two cent's worth.

 

"Throw me to the wolves, and I'll return leading the pack." ---Unknown

"May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't." ---General George S. Patton, Jr.

 

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