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Toby

Crawford Rae, Cappielow and MCT

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Personally speaking from this side of the Irish sea

I just don't see administration. The grants are government grants even as messed up and farcical as the GC reign has become surely to God they can rob Peter to pay Paul till the amount is clarified ...... assuming there is more than a couple of months wages coming in the grant?

 

We can all say what we like about old Dougie's time as the toy trainset controller or however other more colourful or educated you wish to put it....but he surely will be turning in his grave right now.

As for Hopkin.... He was always up against it from the off. The guy genuinely put his money where his mouth was and his colour are laid bare on the mast for all to see!!!

Say what you like about the football this season..I've saw them all..there was method to it at least. Last season post Christmas I definitely thought there was possibilities to move forward with even coming in with a reduced budget but further cuts...tough ask. Where we might be now if he had a McInally budget?

 

 

.....yeah before someone says it....a squad of 50 no hopers

 

I would have him back to see what he could actually do in a properly ran club. Well we know what he can do let's be fair. 

To go from Bradford to this... the big fella Musta upset somebody upstairs when he left Livi.

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Understandably it shouldn't have come to this but in regards to getting rid of 6 players, I don't think it would be the most difficult job. Wallace, Colville, MacIver, McPake, Muirhead and Blues.

There may be a loss of squad depth or talent but tough luck, I'm sure we could bring a few boys back from loans to fill out the squad. 

Regarding the bigger picture, I do find it interesting that since the pandemic hit, the Easdales (for better or worse) have not even hinted at helping out their "local team". Or maybe this is what they wanted? 

It's worrying times ahead. Sometimes I wish Morton just didn't bother being there when they ruin most Saturday's week in and week out but I couldn't not have them. 

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12 minutes ago, ChampTon said:

Understandably it shouldn't have come to this but in regards to getting rid of 6 players, I don't think it would be the most difficult job. Wallace, Colville, MacIver, McPake, Muirhead and Blues.

There may be a loss of squad depth or talent but tough luck, I'm sure we could bring a few boys back from loans to fill out the squad. 

Regarding the bigger picture, I do find it interesting that since the pandemic hit, the Easdales (for better or worse) have not even hinted at helping out their "local team". Or maybe this is what they wanted? 

It's worrying times ahead. Sometimes I wish Morton just didn't bother being there when they ruin most Saturday's week in and week out but I couldn't not have them. 

Have the Easdales shown much interest since MCT announcements? Might not care for us now if they can’t own us down the line

Edited by Renfrew
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39 minutes ago, Renfrew said:

Have the Easdales shown much interest since MCT announcements? Might not care for us now if they can’t own us down the line

They’ll be more concerned about their team’s poor performance in the Betfred Cup tonight

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1 hour ago, vikingTON said:

The onus is either on GC to plug the hole caused by their own mismanagement or to let MCT organise extra investment in exchange for them fucking off and not on the terms of their previous deal. You might be right about the latter option proving insufficient over time but the club's heirarchy sitting around doing neither and hoping that plugging the club shop for the first time in a decade is going to solve things is not crisis management 101.

Which i presume they (GC) won't do otherwise we wouldn't have a manager paying players wages/expenses etc. I'm not quite sure why Anton would come out and say that if it weren't true, unless it's some stunt by Morton to gently break the news, or get money in pity (which won't happen). I believe it really is this grim and all i see if the Morton BoD burying their heads firmly in the sand. 


TIME FOR CHANGE!

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10 hours ago, TONofmemories said:

This may very well be the case, and i realise im taking this point in isolation and ignoring rest of what's been said, but every other club in Scotland doesn't have a track record of doing fuck all to generate cash via alternative means. Every other club in Scotland hadn't been so inept at all aspects commercial/marketing etc for as long as i can remember. Only 1 family at fault for that. Ultimately, buck stops with them. 

 

This sitting back  and pleading poverty, whilst doing fuck all to help yourself, is NOT good enough and its been accepted for  far too long. 

Don't disagree and we'll see what transpires over the coming weeks with Morton & other clubs. 

No doubt we'll try and get some players off the books, but hopefully we can hold onto enough of a squad and keep eeking out results. 

Looking at the positives, this creates a decent opportunity for MCT to come in and make significant improvements within a relatively short space. Hopefully building up a bit of enthusiasm among the fanbase that has been missing for years. 

Edited by piehutt

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9 hours ago, Nornirontons said:

We can all say what we like about old Dougie's time as the toy trainset controller or however other more colourful or educated you wish to put it....but he surely will be turning in his grave right now.

He can turn all he wants, he is massively complicit in this.

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13 hours ago, EanieMeany said:

It wouldn’t be any loss as long as it’s the right ones who go.

Agreed, but we could end up with a Gretna like situation.

"Club going tits up lads, your free to go if you can find another club."

E.G. Jenkins and McGuffie

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9 hours ago, TONofmemories said:

Which i presume they (GC) won't do otherwise we wouldn't have a manager paying players wages/expenses etc. I'm not quite sure why Anton would come out and say that if it weren't true, unless it's some stunt by Morton to gently break the news, or get money in pity (which won't happen). I believe it really is this grim and all i see if the Morton BoD burying their heads firmly in the sand. 

McElhone is quite clearly close to Hopkin in professional terms and has previous for saying questionable things to the press though: IIRC he was spouting some overblown nonsense after the Hibs defeat last season as Hopkin had once again been sent to the stand. 

I'm not saying that he is making the story up, but an exaggeration of the situation from his angle is probably the case. The thing that doesn't add up is this: if Hopkin was paying expenses, bonuses etc. that would make up part of the players' contracts with the club's full knowledge, then what would be the logic behind the 'falling on his sword to save the club money' line issued about his departure and upheld by McElhone as well? Getting the manager's wage off the books, only to put these expenses/bonuses back on it is not a rational cost-cutting choice. At least one party is not being 100% accurate/truthful IMO and the story is quite possibly being spun from several angles.

That doesn't change the fact that the club is dysfunctional to an alarming degree though.

Edited by vikingTON

The site is supposed to be a place for the extended 'family' of Morton supporters - having an affinity with people that you don't know, because you share a love of your local football club. It's not supposed to be about point scoring and showing how 'clever' or 'funny' you are, or just being downright rude and offensive to people you don't know, because you can get away with it. Unfortunately, it seems the classic case of people who have little standing/presence in real life, use this forum as a way of making themselves feel as if they are something. It's sad, and I've said that before..

 

So, having been on Morton forums for about 15 years I guess, I've had enough... well done t*ssers, another Morton supporter driven away. You can all feel happy at how 'clever' you are

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10 hours ago, dunning1874 said:

I've said often on here that I appreciate the need for MCT to maintain a degree of diplomacy in their dealings with the club, but with how rapidly events are moving this week that doesn't come close to cutting it anymore, there is now no amicable route to the takeover possible and the gloves have to come off.

Nothing with a conciliatory tone is acceptable in the light of what's now in the public domain. The statement which has to come tomorrow should be:

a) demanding answers to questions such as how long the club have known the situation was this drastic, why were they sitting silently about it until Hopkin forced their hand by resigning, is it true that Hopkin was supplementing expenditure out of his own pocket, is it true that wages may not be paid this month, how was this budget arrived at and who was responsible for it. They also need to clarify what knowledge and oversight MCT directors had of these issues.

 b) laying out demands of what they expect to be done now, the central point being Golden Casket immediately handing over control of GMFC to MCT, assets included, in the sure knowledge that failure to do so will lead to a concerted boycott and attack on the reputation of all of Golden Casket's other business interests.

Golden Casket now need to be on the receiving end of Save The Ton v Hugh Scott level action if we're going to save this club. That's obviously harder to coordinate between apathy and a pandemic, but we can't have any apologism for what they've done from the only organisation capable of dislodging them. The pandemic didn't cause this, Golden Casket's negligence did and MCT need to be front and centre making that argument.

I'm not convinced MCT will be ready to take over right now. We are generating 10k/month at the moment. Do we have these 4/6  sponsors who will apparently pay 25k a year lined up and ready to invest now? If MCT come in and only generate 10k a month with no additional income, we would be fecked within weeks. 

I presume GC must be covering the shortfalls week to week at the moment. Would MCT be able to do that? Would be interesting to hear from MCT and if they think they could be in position to take over earlier than planned.

I'm sure Crawford would love to get out now, I'm just not convinced MCT will be ready to step in just yet.

I've seen loads of comments recently about cant wait until MCT take over, I'm a tad concerned that its not going to be as rosey as some believe. 700 fans( I include myself in that)  paying 10k a month wont cut it., especially when those 700 can walk away at any time.  These 4/6 sponsors will be crucial in making this work.

If they are ready, then great but i think we need to hope GC/MCT/Streams/ Gov grants etc see us through until the end of April.


All in with a Doyle Brunson

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10 minutes ago, Madton said:

I'm not convinced MCT will be ready to take over right now. We are generating 10k/month at the moment. Do we have these 4/6  sponsors who will apparently pay 25k a year lined up and ready to invest now? If MCT come in and only generate 10k a month with no additional income, we would be fecked within weeks. 

I presume GC must be covering the shortfalls week to week at the moment. Would MCT be able to do that? Would be interesting to hear from MCT and if they think they could be in position to take over earlier than planned.

I'm sure Crawford would love to get out now, I'm just not convinced MCT will be ready to step in just yet.

I've seen loads of comments recently about cant wait until MCT take over, I'm a tad concerned that its not going to be as rosey as some believe. 700 fans( I include myself in that)  paying 10k a month wont cut it., especially when those 700 can walk away at any time.  These 4/6 sponsors will be crucial in making this work.

If they are ready, then great but i think we need to hope GC/MCT/Streams/ Gov grants etc see us through until the end of April.

Agreed. If we have a genuine ongoing cash flow crisis then walking away and handing to MCT now would be the height of irresponsibility. 

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18 minutes ago, Madton said:

I'm not convinced MCT will be ready to take over right now. We are generating 10k/month at the moment. Do we have these 4/6  sponsors who will apparently pay 25k a year lined up and ready to invest now? If MCT come in and only generate 10k a month with no additional income, we would be fecked within weeks. 

I presume GC must be covering the shortfalls week to week at the moment. Would MCT be able to do that? Would be interesting to hear from MCT and if they think they could be in position to take over earlier than planned.

I'm sure Crawford would love to get out now, I'm just not convinced MCT will be ready to step in just yet.

I've seen loads of comments recently about cant wait until MCT take over, I'm a tad concerned that its not going to be as rosey as some believe. 700 fans( I include myself in that)  paying 10k a month wont cut it., especially when those 700 can walk away at any time.  These 4/6 sponsors will be crucial in making this work.

If they are ready, then great but i think we need to hope GC/MCT/Streams/ Gov grants etc see us through until the end of April.

It would be nice to have more than 700 members. And also I feel MCT should have been a bit clearer up front that this is £10 pm (or however amount) for as long as possible. 

But 700 members is still a reasonable amount of income and should reflect a good cash injection compared to rival clubs. 

The key to the plan is getting the club up and running with proper sponsors, fan engagement and getting the best value out of the staff and other resources. 

Ultimately the club has been running as a subsidiary of GC for the best part of 2 decades so we haven't had to test the market for title sponsors and other commercial deals. 

It's a complete joke that the lottery has been suspended and isn't operating? Why not? The lottery should be managed as a largely automated process where people can buy online tickets and winners and prizes are sent with minimal human input. 

This is just one example of where MCT can come in and sort out a problem and turn the wheel in the right direction where it's been left rudderless. 

Also when Dougie was operating at peak Dougie, paying £100k to Brechin every other season etc. clearly a lot of fans felt that the club didn't need their money and if it was happy to waste resources on vanity signings rather than invest in youth and try and live within our means. It is going to be tough to win a lot of these people back, but hopefully there is a pool of people to tap into. 

I remember winning the league against Stranraer. It was so underwhelming and subdued simply because our resources were so much greater than Stranraer's. I think some fans even felt sorry for Aitken and appreciated he had done a great job with part timers. 

Pricing under the Rae's was also pretty poor and did very little to encourage new or non-die hard fans to games. 

Ultimately the club need to stand on our own two feet under MCT. Hopefully with better and more careful management we can raise more revenue and spend that revenue more wisely. I was encouraged by how bullish MCT are on this front. And getting fans on board again is going to be the main driver of Morton's success now - we will no longer be reliant on GC bailing us out and spending / squandering money we don't otherwise have. 

But If MCT means part time players and even a trip to League 1, then so be it. I'd rather we did that under our own steam and demonstrated how important the fans are again, then have a millionaire giving the impression that our money makes little difference to the success of the club 

 

Edited by piehutt

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25 minutes ago, piehutt said:

It would be nice to have more than 700 members. And also I feel MCT should have been a bit clearer up front that this is £10 pm (or however amount) for as long as possible. 

But 700 members is still a reasonable amount of income and should reflect a good cash injection compared to rival clubs. 

The key to the plan is getting the club up and running with proper sponsors, fan engagement and getting the best value out of the staff and other resources. 

Ultimately the club has been running as a subsidiary of GC for the best part of 2 decades so we haven't had to test the market for title sponsors and other commercial deals. 

It's a complete joke that the lottery has been suspended and isn't operating? Why not? The lottery should be managed as a largely automated process where people can buy online tickets and winners and prizes are sent with minimal human input. 

This is just one example of where MCT can come in and sort out a problem and turn the wheel in the right direction where it's been left rudderless. 

Also when Dougie was operating at peak Dougie, paying £100k to Brechin every other season etc. clearly a lot of fans felt that the club didn't need their money and if it was happy to waste resources on vanity signings rather than invest in youth and try and live within our means. It is going to be tough to win a lot of these people back, but hopefully there is a pool of people to tap into. 

I remember winning the league against Stranraer. It was so underwhelming and subdued simply because our resources were so much greater than Stranraer's. I think some fans even felt sorry for Aitken and appreciated he had done a great job with part timers. 

Pricing under the Rae's was also pretty poor and did very little to encourage new or non-die hard fans to games. 

Ultimately the club need to stand on our own two feet under MCT. Hopefully with better and more careful management we can raise more revenue and spend that revenue more wisely. I was encouraged by how bullish MCT are on this front. And getting fans on board again is going to be the main driver of Morton's success now - we will no longer be reliant on GC bailing us out and spending / squandering money we don't otherwise have. 

But If MCT means part time players and even a trip to League 1, then so be it. I'd rather we did that under our own steam and demonstrated how important the fans are again, then have a millionaire giving the impression that our money makes little difference to the success of the club 

 

Wouldn't disagree with any of that and hopefully once MCT get their feet under the table , they can start to implement their own plans and take us forward. I think we all hope and expect that to be the case.

However, are they ready to come in now and take over in this precarious position? Do they have the  financial backing to see us through until the end of the season on their own? Are these sponsors set up?  I'm not convinced they are and taking over too early could have a far more worrying consequence than leaving it as is until the planned takeover in the Summer.

If they do have the backing, I'm all for it, but I would have expected them to be in place by now if they did. I'm sure Crawford would walk tomorrow if he knew MCT were ready and willing to step in.

 


All in with a Doyle Brunson

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1 hour ago, Madton said:

I'm not convinced MCT will be ready to take over right now. We are generating 10k/month at the moment. Do we have these 4/6  sponsors who will apparently pay 25k a year lined up and ready to invest now? If MCT come in and only generate 10k a month with no additional income, we would be fecked within weeks. 

I presume GC must be covering the shortfalls week to week at the moment. Would MCT be able to do that? Would be interesting to hear from MCT and if they think they could be in position to take over earlier than planned.

I'm sure Crawford would love to get out now, I'm just not convinced MCT will be ready to step in just yet.

I've seen loads of comments recently about cant wait until MCT take over, I'm a tad concerned that its not going to be as rosey as some believe. 700 fans( I include myself in that)  paying 10k a month wont cut it., especially when those 700 can walk away at any time.  These 4/6 sponsors will be crucial in making this work.

If they are ready, then great but i think we need to hope GC/MCT/Streams/ Gov grants etc see us through until the end of April.

I'm sure that people will be willing to contribute to a fighting fund in addition to their current subscription, so long as that money goes to MCT and not straight into GMFC's coffers. That's my stance for one, and they can go through the crowdfunding route to see what extra goodwill they can get as well. If the Raes are out the door then at least some more fans will probably join the group as well.

You're getting ahead of yourself with this taking over with 700 subscribers talk then. The onus is on GC to spell out what the club needs first and if they're not going to contribute then to establish the terms by which MCT can step in. Only after that will we see how much can be raised to see the club through the season.


The site is supposed to be a place for the extended 'family' of Morton supporters - having an affinity with people that you don't know, because you share a love of your local football club. It's not supposed to be about point scoring and showing how 'clever' or 'funny' you are, or just being downright rude and offensive to people you don't know, because you can get away with it. Unfortunately, it seems the classic case of people who have little standing/presence in real life, use this forum as a way of making themselves feel as if they are something. It's sad, and I've said that before..

 

So, having been on Morton forums for about 15 years I guess, I've had enough... well done t*ssers, another Morton supporter driven away. You can all feel happy at how 'clever' you are

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I see the lottery has been frozen which on the face of it seems bizarre when we're desperate for cash, but then I noticed that the jackpot currently sits at 12.5K GBP.

Not a gaming law expert, but given that they've already taken the punters' money, is that even legal?

Edited by Cet Homme Charmant

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1 hour ago, Madton said:

Wouldn't disagree with any of that and hopefully once MCT get their feet under the table , they can start to implement their own plans and take us forward. I think we all hope and expect that to be the case.

However, are they ready to come in now and take over in this precarious position? Do they have the  financial backing to see us through until the end of the season on their own? Are these sponsors set up?  I'm not convinced they are and taking over too early could have a far more worrying consequence than leaving it as is until the planned takeover in the Summer.

If they do have the backing, I'm all for it, but I would have expected them to be in place by now if they did. I'm sure Crawford would walk tomorrow if he knew MCT were ready and willing to step in.

 

as far as I know the plan is still for takeover in April. Not seen anything to the contrary of that. 

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16 minutes ago, dunning1874 said:

I'd presume nothing of the sort, in fact I'd presume the exact opposite, that Golden Casket are doing no such thing and are covering nothing.

Generating the £10K a month via MCT with no additional income is where we are now because Golden Casket are refusing to do anything about it. We also have the situation where fans may be willing to fundraise, purchase merchandise, streams etc and provide revenue to the club over and above their MCT subscriptions, but are unwilling to do so while Golden Casket remain in charge, or at least until they renounce their claim to take the assets with them.

Keeping Golden Casket around therefore isn't necessary to ease the cashflow problem. In fact as they are both the cause of it and the main obstacle to getting through it, getting them out immediately is necessary to ease the cash flow problem. Get them out now and you open up avenues of fundraising that currently don't exist, because in the meantime people aren't going to fund someone just to do a runner with the stadium in a few months, and we might actually get someone willing to give us an honest picture of what the financial situation is so we know what we need to do.

It's obviously not the circumstances MCT would wish to be taking over in, but it's now a choice between them taking over now or letting Golden Casket drive the final nail into the coffin they've been building for 20 years.

They may not be putting a penny in right enough but I'm taking the rumours of being absolutely fecked that they must be doing something otherwise employees won't be getting paid and nothing suggests that's the case.

Of course it might not be as bad as being made out, truth is, no one on here probably knows what's going on and it's all guess work. 

Some clarity from MCT, DM or Crawford would be welcome.

 

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All in with a Doyle Brunson

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32 minutes ago, dunning1874 said:

I'd presume nothing of the sort, in fact I'd presume the exact opposite, that Golden Casket are doing no such thing and are covering nothing.

Generating the £10K a month via MCT with no additional income is where we are now because Golden Casket are refusing to do anything about it. We also have the situation where fans may be willing to fundraise, purchase merchandise, streams etc and provide revenue to the club over and above their MCT subscriptions, but are unwilling to do so while Golden Casket remain in charge, or at least until they renounce their claim to take the assets with them.

Keeping Golden Casket around therefore isn't necessary to ease the cashflow problem. In fact as they are both the cause of it and the main obstacle to getting through it, getting them out immediately is necessary to ease the cash flow problem. Get them out now and you open up avenues of fundraising that currently don't exist, because in the meantime people aren't going to fund someone just to do a runner with the stadium in a few months, and we might actually get someone willing to give us an honest picture of what the financial situation is so we know what we need to do.

It's obviously not the circumstances MCT would wish to be taking over in, but it's now a choice between them taking over now or letting Golden Casket drive the final nail into the coffin they've been building for 20 years.

It wouldn't surprise me if Rae / GC is still keeping cash flow going. Perhaps at a level he hopes to recoup via the bailout or perhaps just more money into the blackhole he knows will be written off at some time down the line. 

I'm guessing Morton needs the best part of £100k a month just to keep the lights on and the fact the club isn't generating the income they had hoped and forecast, Rae realised last week they had to cut costs.

Heard that they thought the Hearts game would generate big streaming income from away fans, which didn't materialise - this is possibly the catalyst for Rae's discussion with Hopkin last week. 

We are already seeing clubs failing to play players - Sheffield Wednesday for one - and it wouldn't surprise me if more stories like this surface in the next week. Stands to reason Morton probably don't have enough in the bank to pay December salaries (which are probably due next week) so if we get to Christmas Eve and nothing more has emerged about salaries not being paid, then we can make a pretty good assessment that GC has put more money in. 

Edited by piehutt
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38 minutes ago, Madton said:

They may not be putting a penny in right enough but I'm taking the rumours of being absolutely fecked that they must be doing something otherwise employees won't be getting paid and nothing suggests that's the case.

Of course it might not be as bad as being made out, truth is, no one on here probably knows what's going on and it's all guess work. 

Some clarity from MCT, DM or Crawford would be welcome.

 

The players were all on part furlough throughout pre season. We've only had one full pay day to contend with since the start of the season - and we've had the season ticket money. 

If GC aren't putting anything in, this seems like exactly the moment when we'd start struggling to pay players. 

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10 minutes ago, SpoonTon said:

The players were all on part furlough throughout pre season. 

Did that setup definitely end at the end of pre season?

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