DreamOakTree

Correct!

It’s not me who’s doing the digging! In any case I’ve just remembered my Dutch Project Manager’s name at both companies. Hopefully he’ll have a better recollection of the dates.

The manager obviously wasn’t taking training for the group I was in though. I don’t think that would happen at any professional club.

I really shouldn’t either, but I’m trying to find the year by what I was doing at work. I first worked at Hereema in Leiden when I lived in Den Haag. I worked on the Ultramar Markham Gas Field Development conceptual design. I then moved to Grootint Shipyard in Swindrech to convert the design into fabrication drawings. At this point I lived in Dordrecht. I see that the Markham Field started production in 1992, so it must’ve been around 1988/89 that I played for Grootint and then trained with Den Haag. I had to travel there by train and bus every Tuesday and Thursday night, getting back after midnight with work the next morning. As there seemed to be no movement with my prospects I felt I had to quit.

The cup match was at Den Haag’s ground in case you’re wondering why the Manager was in attendance!

I’ve just turned 69 so it’ was a bit later. I was working at Grootint Shipyard near Rotterdam, and also played for the Work Football Team. I was in my thirties but the Den Haag manager didn’t know that as I looked much younger and I didn’t make him any the wiser. I played a cup match for Grootint and our coach told me the Den Haag manager was there and wanted to speak with me. He then to my amazement offered me trials with Den Haag, who at that time were in the top four in the Netherlands, with Ajax, PSV and Feyenoord.

Goodwin said George “bullied” Holt, which is a compliment. Same with “Aggression” which is also a compliment. Klopp, Postecoglou and Rodger’s use that term regularly to state that their team are playing the way they want them to. I personally prefer football where we mix it up rather than play tippy tippy sideways passes, that put me to sleep. Let’s stop taking those comments as a slight on our team and say, as I always do, “thank you very much for such complementary comments, as that’s exactly what we set out to do”!

My only involvement in professional football was when I went on trial then trained with Den Haag in Holland. I found the training very difficult as it was based on 7-a-side games of two-touch then one touch then one header etc. The guys I was playing with had been doing this from a very young age and I struggled to keep up. The coach Robbie Rensenbrink kept shouting at me that I was f***ing it up. The best thing I took from it was how the players from all age groups were integrated into the club as equals. After training we all went to the club house from all the different pitches and had a drink together, fruit juice for the youngsters and a beer for us. I didn’t detect any different treatment being applied to individual players based on which level or age group they were at. Everyone was afforded the same training facilities and the opportunity to go wherever it took them in their careers. In my case they never told me at any point that I was going to be released. I had to go and tell my coach that I would never be able to reach the standard of one and two touch football that my fellow players already possessed. Therefore I told them I was leaving before they told me, whenever that was going to happen. That’s probably where I’ve got my bugbear about how development players are integrated to the club set-up and treated as equals.

I appreciate your measured response Toby, which I realise I probably don’t deserve given my previous rants. Drink fuelled or otherwise I have no excuse for such personal insults. I just realised as soon as I replied to you yesterday it was bang on 3pm. I had started penning my response to you (which you certainly did deserve) much earlier and was so determined to get it right I genuinely didn’t notice the timing of it. “Winning the argument” on here is something I have no belief I will be able to achieve in the foreseeable future. The best I can do is attempt to make amends for my previous behaviour, in the hope that my posts will simply be received in the same normal fashion as everyone else on here. I.e. with a response to my point excluding derogatory remarks. On point 1: My assertion at that time, rightly or wrongly, was that Dougie WOULD give everyone a chance, as long as he wasn’t a Morton Academy Graduate. Since that time Wilson has improved and has indeed turned out to be an upgrade on Lyon as you say. 2. This is quite a complex issue as I agree that the fan base don’t need to know the personal conversations between manager and player. My angst in this case arose from the statements of Strapp and Lyon, who disclosed the content of those conversations. I assumed they were telling the truth and that Dougie would have the right to confirm or deny their version of events. 3. I get that now, and that the players’ versions could be tainted by their disappointment at being released. 4. I do agree on that now. Although I do prefer a balance between youth and experience. It’s completely Dougie’s prerogative to put the players on the pitch that he feels are best suited to get a result. He’s certainly been proved correct in that respect with recent results. 5. This issue has been compounded by events changing over time since I first got myself into a state about how I felt our academy graduates were being treated. Each event since that point has either reinforced that view or allayed it, with my emotions pretty much latching onto every reported word. For me the situation has moved incrementally from my perceived treatment of those players, to a situation that is how I would see as normal and acceptable. 6. Once I’d calmed down and started to read reports etc. I searched but couldn’t find those details about Davidson and Keay, hence I asked you at the time to give me the details. Again the timeline is quite complex as to what happened when, but I fully accept your details now, to which you’ve kindly added the appearances of Murdoch and O’Boy. In this case yes, I’m happy to accept that Dougie is now addressing the issue of our academy graduates and how they fit into his plans.

Well if Dougie’s on this forum as has been suggested, then he’ll have seen I’ve apologised several times, and admitted I was completely out of order to make such a personal attack!

Great stats AT, just wondering though if this is the first two perfect consecutive hat-tricks by two different players at the same club? Maybe not just in Scottish Football!

Oh shit I hope he doesn’t check in here at all!

But he did admit his two centre backs couldn’t handle Big George! I’m happy that someone else likes Jim Duffy!

Well done Dougie, Andy and the players for a phenomenal result and performance. Jim Duffy said it’s the most complete centre forward display he’s seen for years, so congrats to big George. To have 4 academy graduates on the pitch just put the icing on the cake! ️

I think you’ve made a total of 6 points there Toby which I’ll try to address: 1. Imrie is prepared to give everyone who shows willingness a chance, e.g. Brandon Diau. Response: I don’t believe I ever said that Dougie is/was not prepared to give players a chance. My original gripe which culminated in an admittedly disgraceful rant,was based purely on my belief that Dougie had something against our academy graduates, but that every other facet of his management policy was spot on. 2. Confidentiality issue. Response: I have never said that Dougie should share his conversations with young players or their parents with the fan base. 3. Dougie explaining to academy graduates why they’re not part of his plans, e.g. Reece Lyon. Response: This was the trigger for my gripe. Both Lyon and Strapp stated in interviews that Dougie told them a considerable time before releasing them, that they had no future at the club and were given no explanation. Lewis McGregor indicated something similar but I didn’t see his interview. 4. No player has a divine right to a career with Morton, academy graduate or otherwise. If they’re not good enough they’ll need to move on. Response: Agree 100%. 5. Dougie having questions to answer on his approach to academy graduates. Response: I believe he did have questions to answer as this affected the club’s development programme, which is an essential part of the club structure. It is evident that he has quite recently started giving those answers with the utmost clarity, the exact opposite of his approach prior to those questions being asked. In the case of Michael Garrity he has possibly taken this further than asked or expected. 6. Davidson and Keay. Response: I asked you previously to clarify how much game time both players have been given, as this was during the time I’d switched myself off from any news about Morton due to my dismay at what was happening. Could you please answer this now so I can give a proper response? In conclusion I am happy with the current situation in that Dougie has clarified his approach to youth players and has backed this up with his actions. Based on what you tell me about Davidson and Keay, those players may be included in those actions.

Thanks for taking the time to respond with your extensive experience of such events. I’ve heard a lot of those stories but you’ve painted a picture of how widespread it is. My point was that the manager should communicate his plans for each player to the player himself, whether keeping or releasing him, which it appears is about to happen in Garrity’s case. I fully agree that this doesn’t need to be communicated to fans, however that is exactly what Dougie has done in this instance.

Strapp, Lyon and McGregor as documented. I didn’t see hard evidence about others who were referenced on here.

Dougie’s explanation indicates that Garrity will be released if the penny doesn’t drop, which it doesn’t seem to have happened. So if as seems likely he is released then the reasons will be crystal clear. I feel this is a recent thing from Dougie to clarify situations. I’m a bit baffled that no-one else is seeing this. I know Dougie doesn’t need to justify his approach towards any player’s part in his plans, but that’s exactly what he’s done here. Don’t you see that? Agreed, but it’s only started happening recently. Surely you can acknowledge that!

That’s what I’m attempting to do now! It won’t be easy as it’s difficult to get a direct response to any of my posts without more emphasis being put on myself for previous posts, quite understandably. It will take time but I’ll keep trying.

My gripe at the time was Dougie not giving the players an explanation as to why they were being released. As well as doing that recently, Dougie has taken it on himself to also explain it to the fans. A similar explanation that’s he’s just given to Michael Garrity. When young players are released from top clubs they know they will be moving down a level in their next move, and there is normally a variety of reasons for different players leaving. This is usually well documented and the players leave on good terms, and usually find a decent move elsewhere. To be released from a mid-table Scottish Championship club, knowing they are moving down a level from there, I feel would need even more of an explanation to help the player deal with it and move on with an idea of what he needs to improve on. Any jobs I’ve had when I’ve been let go, I’ve always been told the reason why. I’ve then tried to correct these failings in my next job. I’m sure that would apply to people I’m most walks of life, most of which don’t have the spotlight on them of a professional footballer. If you’re saying that communication on football matters towards fans is pointless, then surely this forum would also be pointless?

I’ll try one more time to get back on topic: Do you feel that Dougie’s new approach to explaining his decisions on young players’ futures to the fans, but most importantly, to the players, is preferable to just releasing them with no explanation?

Because when you prioritise that sort of language over addressing the topic, that means you are referring to the person you are replying to?

If you can take your dislike for me out of your thoughts on this, can’t you see the benefit of at least letting the player know the reasons he’s being released?

If an explanation is unnecessary, then why has Dougie started giving them?

That was simply a reply to Greacen2000 on a topic that was previously discussed on here (if not resolved), and not a revelation. I agree that if a young player is not in the manager’s plans then he should be told, but also given an explanation which will help him and his family decide what to do next. According to the players in the cases discussed, that didn’t happen. To cite that some of those players haven’t gone on to set the Heather on fire elsewhere doesn’t prove not giving them an explanation was correct. This is why I’m now saying it’s refreshing to hear Dougie is now explaining his thought process on individual players, to the fans as well as the player. If I’ve read this explanation and then the player is released, academy graduate or otherwise, I’ll be disappointed but will accept the manager’s decision as the correct one for the player and the club. I’ve asked the Annan fans for their take on Dougie’s explanation re Michael Garrity, and it appears to be accurate that tracking back to help team mates etc. is not part of his game. To not take on defensive responsibilities when your team’s in a relegation battle is quite concerning. If Dougie has spelled this out to the player and he more or less refuses to add these attributes to his game then I could only agree 100% if Dougie decides to release him if the penny doesn’t drop. Especially when Dougie can get this out of players 10 years older. As I say, clarity from the manager helps greatly and can nip any speculation in the bud. Happy New Year to all Morton Fans!