Match Preview/Thread - Montrose vs Morton (Championship Playoff Semi Finals 8th/11th May)

[vikingTON]

11 minutes ago, TheGoon said:

If we spend multiple years in the third tier, which is a distinct possibility, I’m pretty sure fans would grow disillusioned as well.

Multiple years to potential disillusionment is infinitely better than near-certain disillusionment in Year 1, not least when the plan for transitioning the club to a break-even viable business instead of 'rampaging binfire' will take at least three years of continued buy-in just to complete. That is in the MCT prospectus.

And nothing will be more ruinous to achieving continued buy-in than another season of dire, attritional Gusball trying to cling onto our second tier status. 

"There’s no reason we can’t restructure and keep our heads above water in the Championship."

Let's imagine we somehow survive through the play-offs:

How long does it take to find a chief executive or other backroom staff? 

How long does it take to identify a new manager, or do we cut that corner by just giving the job to a failure like McPherson? 

How do they attract quality players to this football club, now four-five weeks at least behind the rest of the division and with no greater resources to offer than before?

Competition and a huge disadvantage of time are in fact extremely relevant factors, that make your claim an exercise in wishful thinking. We have enough trouble treading water as it is at this level without adding in these problems as well.

It would be a thankless task that would end in a 2013/14 style disaster. 

[EanieMeany]

12 minutes ago, TheGoon said:

If we spend multiple years in the third tier, which is a distinct possibility, I’m pretty sure fans would grow disillusioned as well. I’m also pretty sure MCT would welcome the challenge of doing what they were going to do anyway, 3 weeks behind schedule, if it avoided the possibility of us becoming marooned in the third tier of Scottish Football. There’s no reason we can’t restructure and keep our heads above water in the Championship.

We’re going down anyway, it’s a pointless debate, but I worry much more for our future than I would have had we remained in the league. 

Aye, this. I simply don’t see the prospect of MCT being enough to keep people interested, after the shambles of this season which has been years in the making, it’s optimistic in the extreme to think there’s much chance of the club coming back stronger if we’re stuck in the third tier for years. The rot and apathy is far too far gone to think we’re going to avoid being Airdrie.

[TheGoon]

6 minutes ago, vikingTON said:

Multiple years to potential disillusionment is infinitely better than near-certain disillusionment in Year 1, not least when the plan for transitioning the club to a break-even viable business instead of 'rampaging binfire' will take at least three years of continued buy-in just to complete. That is in the MCT prospectus.

And nothing will be more ruinous to achieving continued buy-in than another season of dire, attritional Gusball trying to cling onto our second tier status. 

"There’s no reason we can’t restructure and keep our heads above water in the Championship."

Let's imagine we somehow survive through the play-offs:

How long does it take to find a chief executive or other backroom staff? 

How long does it take to identify a new manager, or do we cut that corner by just giving the job to a failure like McPherson? 

How do they attract quality players to this football club, now four-five weeks at least behind the rest of the division and with no greater resources to offer than before?

Competition and a huge disadvantage of time are in fact extremely relevant factors, that make your claim an exercise in wishful thinking. We have enough trouble treading water as it is at this level without adding in these problems as well.

It would be a thankless task that would end in a 2013/14 style disaster. 

We’re already not favourites for League 1 next season though. These same issues are going to exist and a season of complete and utter mediocrity at League 1 level is going to knock just as many punters off the gates as a relegation would. I’d have much rather had a chance at staying up next season rather than jobbing about with ‘Clyde’ and MCT will have been the exact same. 

[vikingTON]

18 minutes ago, EanieMeany said:

The rot and apathy is far too far gone to think we’re going to avoid being Airdrie.

If you think that the cut-off between support for a fan-owned club and apathy is 'achieving' 7/8th in the Championship every year then you're deluded. And if fan ownership is going to be contingent on not ever getting relegated to a lower tier then we're as well just folding now - because that's going to happen regardless of this season's play-off outcome.

 

[vikingTON]

18 minutes ago, TheGoon said:

We’re already not favourites for League 1 next season though.

We weren't favourites last time we went down either.

Not that this matters, because the long-term rebuild should actually be the priority, instead of trying to yo-yo our way between two leagues while not getting the essential work done elsewhere. 

"These same issues are going to exist and a season of complete and utter mediocrity at League 1 level is going to knock just as many punters off the gates as a relegation would."

Incorrect. Morton will have significantly greater resources in League One than the bulk of that division, which is an advantage that can compensate for our very slow start to recruitment. There is no such advantage over any single one of our competitors in the Championship, with the exception of Arbroath who are on a different model. 

Which is why a gormless survival bid in the Championship next season will be hamstrung from the start and will fail. 

"I’d have much rather had a chance at staying up next season rather than jobbing about with ‘Clyde’ and MCT will have been the exact same."

And emotive, short-sighted sentiment like this is exactly what MCT need to check, in trying to transform this clowncar football club into an efficient business. 

 

[TaunTon]

2 minutes ago, TheGoon said:

I’d have much rather had a chance at staying up next season rather than jobbing about with ‘Clyde’ and MCT will have been the exact same. 

That ship has sailed and whether we like it or not we are 95% likely to be plying our trade in Div1. We had plenty of chances to avoid this but a lack of ability, leadership (on and off the park) and management has led us to this. 

We may not be able to bounce back quickly but we should be able to put a squad together that can at least compete for a top 4 position if we get the management decision right. 

The club desperately needs a root and branch rebuild rather than short term tinkering and a strategy that relies on just doing enough to come 8th in the Championship.

I expect plenty of frustrations over the next few years as we come to terms with the club being ours but the prize could be so much better than the 2 decades of Rae inspired mediocrity, total irrelevance and rank amateurism that we've been subjected to. 

[dunning1874]

What happens to the theory that relegation is the saving grace which prevents fans disillusionment because survival in the Championship guarantees turgid football and a relegation battle if we end up with turgid football and a relegation battle in League One?

[TaunTon]

I don't see relegation as a saving grace but it does offer an opportunity to rethink and redesign. The fact that it is now a virtual certainty makes a large part of this discussion academic.

We either embrace it with all it's risk or we meekly roll over and think back to the halcyon days of the Rae's enlightenment and benevolent leadership.

[vikingTON]

14 hours ago, dunning1874 said:

What happens to the theory that relegation is the saving grace which prevents fans disillusionment because survival in the Championship guarantees turgid football and a relegation battle if we end up with turgid football and a relegation battle in League One?

The prospect of a relegation battle in League One next season is probably 10%. 

The prospect of a relegation battle in the Championship next season is >90%. 

Those are compelling odds on which to base any decision, in the absence of time travel. 

 

[Scozzie]

I just watched those highlights.... Montrose aren't much... played them on a synthetic pitch ( which is to their advantage) they know how to handle the wind behind their backs (again to their advantage) 2 opportunist goals which they took very well... I think  when they come to Cappielow we will be too much for them to handle .. but you never know what happens in football ... fingers crossed.

[TheGoon]

27 minutes ago, Scozzie said:

I just watched those highlights.... Montrose aren't much... played them on a synthetic pitch ( which is to their advantage) they know how to handle the wind behind their backs (again to their advantage) 2 opportunist goals which they took very well... I think  when they come to Cappielow we will be too much for them to handle .. but you never know what happens in football ... fingers crossed.

We have won one home game since the middle of December. 

[Scozzie]

3 minutes ago, TheGoon said:

We have won one home game since the middle of December. 

Let's face it we should have beaten Hearts and Alloa at home and we wouldn't be in this mess .... so now is a good time to rectify only winning once at home.

[The Bewilderedbeast]

1 hour ago, Scozzie said:

I just watched those highlights.... Montrose aren't much... played them on a synthetic pitch ( which is to their advantage) they know how to handle the wind behind their backs (again to their advantage) 2 opportunist goals which they took very well... I think  when they come to Cappielow we will be too much for them to handle .. but you never know what happens in football ... fingers crossed.

I admire your optimism.

I'm generally a glass half full type of guy when it comes to Morton, but I just can't see where a goal is coming from.

No shots on goal v Arbroath in the most important league game of the season, two shots against Montrose, one goal and an easy save for their keeper (only after going behind).

The wind was the same for both teams on Saturday, why weren't we taking shots from around the edge of the box and trying to use the wind to OUR advantage.

I hope your right, but unfortunately can't see it.

[SpoonTon]

2 hours ago, Scozzie said:

I just watched those highlights.... Montrose aren't much... played them on a synthetic pitch ( which is to their advantage) they know how to handle the wind behind their backs (again to their advantage) 2 opportunist goals which they took very well... I think  when they come to Cappielow we will be too much for them to handle .. but you never know what happens in football ... fingers crossed.

I get where you're coming from. While we hadn't looked like much of an attacking force since the first half hour of the match, I didn't feel like we were going to concede until Fjortoft lose all control of his legs. The second was almost as bad, in its own way, with McLean just having to get close enough to cut the angle to the back post. We all know that we struggle to score - we managed to get one but that was a game that we should have conceded one at most. 

Losing an away tie by a single goal isn't a complete disaster, but it does make Montrose slight favourites given our struggles to score. It's a big if, but if we do our job defensively I think we'll win the game - but I'm not sure if we will do that job and we still might need penalties to win the tie. 

I still very much hope that we can win the tie, and I think it's a long way from being hopeless cause, but Montrose have to be slight favourites. We'll need to show something that we haven't really shown this season - hopefully we'll do just that and win 3-0 or something. 

[vikingTON]

Surprise, surprise, McPherson "cannot fault the effort of the players for the large part" once again in Saturday's dismal showing.

Get out of this club you Jim McInally level fraud. 

[DreamOakTree]

I must admit for all our many flaws, I thought we were set up as a team who could hold a one goal lead better than most, as scoring was our main problem, keeping teams out at the other end was right up our street. Watching the game I was thinking a draw was the worst we could come away with. Even though Montrose scored with two outrageous strikes for a team at their level, I still felt we should have had enough to take something from the game. I’m still hopeful of somehow surviving the play-offs, but won’t be surprised if we don’t. 

[TRVMP]

10 minutes ago, DreamOakTree said:

I must admit for all our many flaws, I thought we were set up as a team who could hold a one goal lead better than most, as scoring was our main problem, keeping teams out at the other end was right up our street. Watching the game I was thinking a draw was the worst we could come away with. Even though Montrose scored with two outrageous strikes for a team at their level, I still felt we should have had enough to take something from the game. I’m still hopeful of somehow surviving the play-offs, but won’t be surprised if we don’t. 

They were nice finishes but the first goal was at least 50% down to Fjortoft's inability to stand up and walk three feet.

[DreamOakTree]

11 minutes ago, TRVMP said:

They were nice finishes but the first goal was at least 50% down to Fjortoft's inability to stand up and walk three feet.

That’s the type of thing that caught me by surprise. The defence have been reliable and have did what it says on the tin at Championship level, yet all of a sudden when it matters most they develop similar flaws to our forward players - lack of concentration at critical moments, the second goal was also avoidable, or at least the run into the Channel was. I’m starting to think VT might have a case in ripping it up and starting again in League 1.

[LargsTON]

On 5/9/2021 at 1:51 PM, EanieMeany said:

Anybody that thinks this club can somehow survive a few years in the third tier and re-emerge as a serious Championship club is kidding themselves on.

Correct.  We're done.

[LargsTON]

On 5/9/2021 at 7:41 PM, dunning1874 said:

What happens to the theory that relegation is the saving grace which prevents fans disillusionment because survival in the Championship guarantees turgid football and a relegation battle if we end up with turgid football and a relegation battle in League One?

That's exactly where i see us headed I'm afraid.  Many see MCT as the saviours but I see it as the beginning of the end of Morton as a club with any serious aspirations to be a top flight club ever again.  I can see us dropping again next season.  The whole mood around the club is the worst I can ever recall.