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So America Decided


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Guest David Edwards

Serious question: do you maybe think you're not both underestimating him a bit? Spending far less than the likes of Jeb Bush, and with virtually the entire party against him, and with endorsements in the single figures, he easily won the Republican primary. He then ended the Clintons' political careers, again spending greater a fraction of what they did, with virtually the entire media and all of mass entertainment against him. You don't do that without having some understanding of what makes people tick.

Not at all. Anyone who comes from nowhere in politics, who starts out as a joke candidate in the primaries, and then goes on to be elected President of the most powerful country in the world is certainly not to be underestimated. Viewed with considerable suspicion - yes, but underestimated - no.

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He said sex tape, not porn movie. I'm not going to accuse you of erecting (fnarr) a straw man - I imagine you were either reading a headline or just misremembered. That said, maybe sex tape wasn't accurate either. What do you call it when someone has sex on TV? I don't know.

 

Machado was brought to the US by the ruling party and fast-tracked through the citizenship process - a privilege that wouldn't be granted the likes of me - specifically to oppose Trump. Did Trump treat her badly? In my view, not at the time of the alleged offense. His tweets certainly weren't very nice though. Should he have stayed out of it? Not in my view. Machado was weaponized by a feckless and nihilistic DNC and, like any weapon launched at you, was shot out of the sky.

Not really sure what you find so objectionable about my opinion. I've made it clear I don't care a jot about his domestic policies, my only fear is how he will react if he perceives that a foreign leader or country has wronged him. You think that fear is unfounded. While your unquestioning faith in the man's integrity and mental stability is touching, in reality neither of us know how the next 4 or 8 years will pan out, so it's a pointless discussion.

 

It goes without saying that I hope you're right and I'm wrong.

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Not at all. Anyone who comes from nowhere in politics, who starts out as a joke candidate in the primaries, and then goes on to be elected President of the most powerful country in the world is certainly not to be underestimated. Viewed with considerable suspicion - yes, but underestimated - no.

 

Fair play.

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Not really sure what you find so objectionable about my opinion. I've made it clear I don't care a jot about his domestic policies, my only fear is how he will react if he perceives that a foreign leader or country has wronged him. You think that fear is unfounded. While your unquestioning faith in the man's integrity and mental stability is touching, in reality neither of us know how the next 4 or 8 years will pan out, so it's a pointless discussion.

 

It goes without saying that I hope you're right and I'm wrong.

 

Right, neither of us knows, I could be completely wrong, but I think we're repeating ourselves now. I've explained why I think it's 90% an act. Time will tell.

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It absolutely does need personality insight. If you're relying on headlines you're completely missing the bigger picture. You're operating several degrees removed from the action here. I've given a couple of concrete examples of where he's supposedly said something ~absolutely outrageous~ yet he's landed on his feet: Mexico and Saudi Arabia. What evidence do you have for your point?

How do you figure that he's landed on his feet with regards to Mexico? I need to catch up on all of this stuff.

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How do you figure that he's landed on his feet with regards to Mexico? I need to catch up on all of this stuff.

 

He made what almost amounted to a state visit to Mexico during the campaign, during one of Hillary's mystery absences from the national stage, and met with President ENP. By all accounts this went well - while the two leaders had and will continue to have their differences, he wasn't wearing some kind of rape-themed t-shirt. He won more Hispanics - admittedly not yet broken down by country - than the craven, supine figure of Mitt Romney. Meanwhile the likes of Vicente Fox are left ranting in the darkness. It's really difficult to see how it could have gone any better for him. 

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Serious question: do you maybe think you're not both underestimating him a bit? Spending far less than the likes of Jeb Bush, and with virtually the entire party against him, and with endorsements in the single figures, he easily won the Republican primary. He then ended the Clintons' political careers, again spending greater a fraction of what they did, with virtually the entire media and all of mass entertainment against him. You don't do that without having some understanding of what makes people tick.

 

Racism; misogyny; nostalgia for the 1950s where people (particularly those pesky non-white, heterosexual Christian males) knew their place - or got sent to the relevant Senate committee for their thought crimes. Hardly an enthralling demonstration of the new politics as much as it is the dog-whistle, reactionary decision of complete and utter morons. 

 

Clinton losing the electoral college while comfortably winning the popular vote puts her alongside 'Dundee spending £20 million to win nothing' in the all-time, 'Dundeeing it' stakes. 

The site is supposed to be a place for the extended 'family' of Morton supporters - having an affinity with people that you don't know, because you share a love of your local football club. It's not supposed to be about point scoring and showing how 'clever' or 'funny' you are, or just being downright rude and offensive to people you don't know, because you can get away with it. Unfortunately, it seems the classic case of people who have little standing/presence in real life, use this forum as a way of making themselves feel as if they are something. It's sad, and I've said that before..

 

So, having been on Morton forums for about 15 years I guess, I've had enough... well done t*ssers, another Morton supporter driven away. You can all feel happy at how 'clever' you are

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Racism; misogyny; nostalgia for the 1950s where people (particularly those pesky non-white, heterosexual Christian males) knew their place - or got sent to the relevant Senate committee for their thought crimes. Hardly an enthralling demonstration of the new politics as much as it is the dog-whistle, reactionary decision of complete and utter morons. 

 

You didn't know anything about the US Presidential election in February and you don't know anything about the US Presidential election now. As long as you cling to these delusions you'll continue to call elections wrongly, which is of course fine by me - and more importantly you and the people who share your opinions will have absolutely no hope of undoing the damage you've done to the Clinton/business as usual/neocon lobby in the US. Which is great news for everyone. Until you actually try to understand what's happened you're pissing up a flagpole.

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You didn't know anything about the US Presidential election in February and you don't know anything about the US Presidential election now. As long as you cling to these delusions you'll continue to call elections wrongly, which is of course fine by me - and more importantly you and the people who share your opinions will have absolutely no hope of undoing the damage you've done to the Clinton/business as usual/neocon lobby in the US. Which is great news for everyone. Until you actually try to understand what's happened you're pissing up a flagpole.

 

You say that as if Trump won in an earth-shattering landslide: he didn't. His margin in the decisive states was under 1%. The two worst candidates clashed in US political history and Clinton simply managed to out-Dundee her opponent. 

 

I couldn't give a toss about "undoing damage" to the Clintons or neo-conservatives, because I don't agree with their views and I'm not an American citizen. 

The site is supposed to be a place for the extended 'family' of Morton supporters - having an affinity with people that you don't know, because you share a love of your local football club. It's not supposed to be about point scoring and showing how 'clever' or 'funny' you are, or just being downright rude and offensive to people you don't know, because you can get away with it. Unfortunately, it seems the classic case of people who have little standing/presence in real life, use this forum as a way of making themselves feel as if they are something. It's sad, and I've said that before..

 

So, having been on Morton forums for about 15 years I guess, I've had enough... well done t*ssers, another Morton supporter driven away. You can all feel happy at how 'clever' you are

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Even if Trump is the most clever man on the planet hiding behind a mask his public and not so public comments are not endearing.

 

At least in Scotland we have some experience of how Trump operates. I think thin-skinned is being kind to the Trump.

 

On a positive Nacho you will never be out of work when Trump starts on the wall.

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Guest David Edwards

 

 

At least in Scotland we have some experience of how Trump operates.

 

 

 

Yes, and he made a chump out of Salmond for sure.

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Even if Trump is the most clever man on the planet hiding behind a mask his public and not so public comments are not endearing.

 

At least in Scotland we have some experience of how Trump operates. I think thin-skinned is being kind to the Trump.

 

On a positive Nacho you will never be out of work when Trump starts on the wall.

Saw a young guy in ultra-rich Highland Park the other day, probably 18 or so, with a 'Border Wall Construction Crew' t-shirt on. Now, most millennials who bothered to vote did so for Clinton, but there is a not-inconsiderate youth movement for Trump. It's too simplistic to give just one reason for this, but in my view a huge contributing factor is that supporting Trump is seen as an act of mildly edgy rebellion. Unless you're here living among it it's hard to fully understand the extent of finger-wagging and scolding directed at Trump supporters over the past year. Hillary is the scowling principal and Trump is the class clown. We're well and truly into uncharted waters when a billionaire in a suit - President of the country! - is a minor symbol of teen rebellion

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I couldn't care less about his domestic polices as none of them will have any tangible effect on me or my family. 

 

It's is thin skin, volatility and unpredictability that worries me, he's a loose cannon when someone winds him  up (which is ridiculously easy to do), and his reactions could have global consequences. I hope he'll be as benign as you suggest but his track record during the campaign would suggest otherwise so I have my real doubts. 

 

For some reason a young Rickie Lamie playing for Airdrie against Morton and up against Spoonsy came to mind there.

"Any nation given the opportunity to regain its national sovereignty and which then rejects it is so far beneath contempt that it is hard to put words to it."

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I seem to remember a lot of similar agnst being expressed when Ronald Regan got elected and somehow he managed to turn into the most respected Republican president in decades. Trump's got a far harder job to do in winning over those who despise him but he has shown he can confound his critics and if nothing else he's finally put the nail in the Bush/Clinton cabals coffin and shut up a host of vacuous Hollywood celebrities.

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Utterly clueless. You'll be wrong in 2020 as well.

 

Yes you're right: that winning candidate of whom roughly 60% of the electorate held an unfavourable opinion and also viewed as "untrustworthy", the highest recorded figures in the history of scientific polling in the US, (http://www.nbcnews.com/card/nbc-news-exit-poll-honesty-vs-temperament-n680296; http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/trump_favorableunfavorable-5493.html) is in fact a super-fantastic dreamboat that your country has fully rallied behind. Hence the riots of enthusiasm. 

 

 

I seem to remember a lot of similar agnst being expressed when Ronald Regan got elected and somehow he managed to turn into the most respected Republican president in decades. 

 

Leaving aside the hagiography surrounding Reagan's presidency (if the nuclear brinkmanship and global political instability of his first term is appealing, then stay tuned for the potential repeat) it's worth bearing in mind that he stood for the highest political office only after serving as governor of California, the most populous state. And didn't stand on a ticket of labeling Mexicans as 'rapists' and a back of a fag packet economic policy. Reagan possessed experienced and intelligent advisors - even if politically reprehensible - whereas it remains to be seen whether Trump will have anything other than fluffers at the helm of his administration. 

The site is supposed to be a place for the extended 'family' of Morton supporters - having an affinity with people that you don't know, because you share a love of your local football club. It's not supposed to be about point scoring and showing how 'clever' or 'funny' you are, or just being downright rude and offensive to people you don't know, because you can get away with it. Unfortunately, it seems the classic case of people who have little standing/presence in real life, use this forum as a way of making themselves feel as if they are something. It's sad, and I've said that before..

 

So, having been on Morton forums for about 15 years I guess, I've had enough... well done t*ssers, another Morton supporter driven away. You can all feel happy at how 'clever' you are

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Incidentally, I know anecdotes aren't worth much, but I served as a driver in a secure vehicle in Trump's motorcade recently when he was in Dallas for a fundraiser. There were four other volunteers. One was a stereotypical Trump voter - ex-military, skinhead, very tough manner, ready to Make America Great Again. The other was a first-generation Chinese immigrant, an accountant. One was a housewife and substitute teacher. The other was a woman who ran a gourmet hot dog factory. This was after Pussygate. None were from Dallas itself except me. The city of Dallas is not Trump country - this is a Democratic city and the GOP that is here hates Trump because he totally BTFO'd the Bushes, who run things around here. Consider this an urban-rural divide on a small scale. Trump brought together previously disaffected constituencies from suburbs and the rust belt and rural areas and won. Because he knew what he was doing.

 

I'm confused yet fascinated by this. Why are civilians involved in a motorcade for presidential  candidates?   

Good people will do good things, bad people will do bad things, but only with religion do good people do bad things!

 

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