Sfl Clubs To Vote On Newco, 12 July - Will We

[Guest David Edwards]

All,

 

I have been reading all the anti-rangers stuff, can we assume that if it were Celtic they would get the same abuse?

 

 

Brian.

 

Abuse? Treatment is a more appropriate term in the circumstances. And yes, Celtic would get the same. Never mind Celtic, I can honestly say that even if it was Morton I'd advocate the same.

Leaving aside 'Oldco' Rangers' shameful history of sectarianism and, more recently, their buying success at the expense of the taxman and other creditors, 'Newco' Rangers should be treated fairly in any application to join the SFL. As fairly as any other new applicant, i.e. they'll have to begin at the beginning in Division 3 if their application is succesful.

Right now, with Green in charge, that should be a big if.

[ton5saints1]

Abuse? Treatment is a more appropriate term in the circumstances. And yes, Celtic would get the same. Never mind Celtic, I can honestly say that even if it was Morton I'd advocate the same.

Leaving aside 'Oldco' Rangers' shameful history of sectarianism and, more recently, their buying success at the expense of the taxman and other creditors, 'Newco' Rangers should be treated fairly in any application to join the SFL. As fairly as any other new applicant, i.e. they'll have to begin at the beginning in Division 3 if their application is succesful.

Right now, with Green in charge, that should be a big if.

 

absolutely agree, and that's why I asked Gillian about the voting system as I was sure there would be some sort of move to change it as there was a growing 'No' vote fromSFL clubs for division 1 entry.

And if the rules are changed on the voting system, can they come into force immediately ?

An absolute shambles, and an attempt by Doncaster and co to pressurise SFL chairmen in an attempt to get the decision they want - 'newco' into the first division.

They are showing sheer and utter contempt to every football fan in Scotland.

[big B]

A U-turn never in a million years

With all the poltics and jiggery pokery going on in the SPL I would not be the least bit suprised to see The Rangers Fc still in the SPL come midnight tomorrow night.

[ton5saints1]

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With all the poltics and jiggery pokery going on in the SPL I would not be the least bit suprised to see The Rangers Fc still in the SPL come midnight tomorrow night.

 

I think that's a contradiction in terms 'THE Rangers STILL in the SPL.

 

I'm away to the pub !

[SpoonTon]

All,

 

I have been reading all the anti-rangers stuff, can we assume that if it were Celtic they would get the same abuse?

 

I believe Rangers should start in the 3rd but do not believe they should be taking the xtra stick they are receiving considering 1 man has effectively ruined a club with 100+ years tradition, I would say the same if it were Celtic.

 

It gets on my nerves when old firm fans think they are better than everyone else but I feel everyone is taking this way to far.

 

I reckon Rangers will be a force again in 5+ years and they will not forget who was kicking them when they were down.

 

Whose to say that in the future any team who seem anti-rangers now may have a boycot of Rangers fans when they are drawn in a cup tie, which is a big bonus for small clubs.

 

Be careful Morton Fans , we want justice but some want to twist the knife which is not nice and a bit below the belt.

 

Brian.

 

I'm not sure what you're going on about TBH. Can we have some examples of the things that are 'twisting the knife'?

 

All that most people want is for Rangers to be treated like any other club. For years we've been belittled, and called small clubs in a very condescending tone; as if we are just the extras in their game. For Rangers to get special treatment would send the message that they are special, and we really are all just the little extras in their game.

 

If you like you could look back at what Morton fans thought of what happened to Gretna - it's not just because it's Rangers (and I have no idea why you have to add in the Celtic comparison <_>

 

I honestly don't care about the support Rangers might bring in a cup tie. We may as well draw St Mirren or Killie for the crowd they bring, at least we would have a chance of winning. We've had one Scottish cup tie against Rangers in about 20 years - so you're warning isn't exactly terrifying. I hate drawing either of the OF at Cappielow, I find it to be a cringeworthy experience.

 

And if any other SPL clubs end up in financial bother because Rangers have to apply to get into the SFL, then it will be their own fault for creating a closed shop of a top flight where they've been trying to live off the OF's TV money for years. And they might have to apply to get into the SFL as a new team as well, and it will serve them right. But the true fans will battle on and these clubs, just like Rangers, will continue in some form. Rangers fans should count themselves lucky that they still have some players, and they still have excellent facilities - it's much more than we had in terms of assets, and we weren't even liquidated!

[chrissiboi]

Aye reading the stuff on P & B about the Midden's meeting, as we all expected the ugly sisters, two cheeks of the same arse are actively trying to keep the voting system and share of Tv money.

 

Lots of rumours and misinformation , someone quoting that if Sevco 5088 FC do not gain entry into the first it will leave a £18 million black hole, inflation is out of control it was 16 million yesterday. So the fear factor is getting pumped up.

 

So what about the chairman who have spoken out for 'sporting integrity' Turnbull Hutton, DDFR what incentive is there for them to stay within a game that has shown up to be complicate with cheating.

[vespaton]

Hi Brian,

 

Couple of points.

 

It was not "one man" that ruined the club. It has alledgedly been years and years of systematic and deliberate cheating with more than one person complicit.

 

Under the guidance of the Murray tenure, before that there was no cheating.

 

Also we cannot use fear of their fans to cloud our judgment. Besides, most gers fans want to start again in div 3 according to most reports.

 

I know of some Rangers fans who want this, some want this to show 2 fingers to the SFA /SPL.

[vespaton]

I'm not sure what you're going on about TBH. Can we have some examples of the things that are 'twisting the knife'?

 

Theres been a lot of people lapping it up

 

All that most people want is for Rangers to be treated like any other club. For years we've been belittled, and called small clubs in a very condescending tone; as if we are just the extras in their game. For Rangers to get special treatment would send the message that they are special, and we really are all just the little extras in their game.

 

They have a home support of 50000 and an international following, you can't tell me you think Morton should be treated with equality

 

If you like you could look back at what Morton fans thought of what happened to Gretna - it's not just because it's Rangers (and I have no idea why you have to add in the Celtic comparison <_>

 

Everyone and their granny hated Gretna

 

I honestly don't care about the support Rangers might bring in a cup tie. We may as well draw St Mirren or Killie for the crowd they bring, at least we would have a chance of winning. We've had one Scottish cup tie against Rangers in about 20 years - so you're warning isn't exactly terrifying. I hate drawing either of the OF at Cappielow, I find it to be a cringeworthy experience.

 

Yeah...but we keep our fingers crossed we get an away tie to grab the $$$$ just ask Mr Rae

 

And if any other SPL clubs end up in financial bother because Rangers have to apply to get into the SFL, then it will be their own fault for creating a closed shop of a top flight where they've been trying to live off the OF's TV money for years. And they might have to apply to get into the SFL as a new team as well, and it will serve them right. But the true fans will battle on and these clubs, just like Rangers, will continue in some form. Rangers fans should count themselves lucky that they still have some players, and they still have excellent facilities - it's much more than we had in terms of assets, and we weren't even liquidated!

 

But that's what businesses do, they speculate on their future income and invest based on these figures to enable them to compete.

 

[capitanus]

Everyone and their granny hated Gretna

 

They didn't though.

 

I hated Gretna, I thought they were a horrible shower of **** with an unsustainable business model, but they were the darlings of the media with the whole "Living The Dream" crap, and their chairman Brooks Mileson even had a newspaper column boasting about how he smokes a sleeve of B&H every day whilst drinking a gallon of Lucozade, whilst gifting all these supporters trusts money which he never had.

 

They cheated Morton out of the second division, but hey Brooks Mileson was good for the game and it was a fairytale to the end.

 

 

Alibi loved him, though.

[chrissiboi]

I'm not sure what you're going on about TBH. Can we have some examples of the things that are 'twisting the knife'?

 

Theres been a lot of people lapping it up

 

All that most people want is for Rangers to be treated like any other club. For years we've been belittled, and called small clubs in a very condescending tone; as if we are just the extras in their game. For Rangers to get special treatment would send the message that they are special, and we really are all just the little extras in their game.

 

They have a home support of 50000 and an international following, you can't tell me you think Morton should be treated with equality

 

 

If you like you could look back at what Morton fans thought of what happened to Gretna - it's not just because it's Rangers (and I have no idea why you have to add in the Celtic comparison ).

 

Everyone and their granny hated Gretna

 

I honestly don't care about the support Rangers might bring in a cup tie. We may as well draw St Mirren or Killie for the crowd they bring, at least we would have a chance of winning. We've had one Scottish cup tie against Rangers in about 20 years - so you're warning isn't exactly terrifying. I hate drawing either of the OF at Cappielow, I find it to be a cringeworthy experience.

 

Yeah...but we keep our fingers crossed we get an away tie to grab the $$$$ just ask Mr Rae

 

And if any other SPL clubs end up in financial bother because Rangers have to apply to get into the SFL, then it will be their own fault for creating a closed shop of a top flight where they've been trying to live off the OF's TV money for years. And they might have to apply to get into the SFL as a new team as well, and it will serve them right. But the true fans will battle on and these clubs, just like Rangers, will continue in some form. Rangers fans should count themselves lucky that they still have some players, and they still have excellent facilities - it's much more than we had in terms of assets, and we weren't even liquidated!

 

But that's what businesses do, they speculate on their future income and invest based on these figures to enable them to compete.

 

 

While the SPL is a set up that has been built on the promise of the never never the SFA must uphold the rules in which all clubs must come under that jurisdiction. Whether you have 50,000 or 500 the same criteria of professionalism must be upheld. I would think the more high profile you are the greater transparency required as there is a sense of publicity awarded.

 

From what I have seen there has been a campaign to save them, the biggest culprit being Celtic who know without Sevco whatever they will be allowed to call themselves their position in voting structure and in ensuring the lions share of Tv money and sponsorship. All we are seeing is a rebalancing of that power.

 

The whole Rangers empire was built on a lie and everyone blindly followed that model , now the whole of Scottish football needs to get back from the brink.

 

My own anger stems from looking at the Rangers Media and Follow Follow sites and it makes this place seem like an academic convention. A horrible vengeful rage is evident with a resistance to eradicate sectarianism which has no part to play in society.

 

Although in dealing with this matter I just want rules to be applied fairly, Rangers are about to be liquidated and the case has still to be fully unravelled which I am wary of.

It is not as if Green's consortium are filling the place with confidence about finances so again there is a scepticism that his cohorts have the clout to pull this off. There is an agenda with Green, obviously the quicker he can return the club to the SPL then the quicker he can sell up with a tidy profit after taking all the indignation of the diddy team tag. What happens if he doesn't have the money and Rangers Phoenix club goes back into administration can you imagine the laughing stock we would become worldwide.

 

Football is dying a slow death under the present system and I see no advantage of trying to return one of the guilty to the lofty position of being top of the SPL. We know this system and structure is not working so why not try something different but we only have the opportunity to do that under the circumstances. If we allow this sham then it will render any restructuring/play offs/ whatever changes as you will have lost the bulk of confidence by the actions to allow rule breakers a pass.

[ton5saints1]

For those who don't follow Alex Thomson on the Chanel 4 news website - please do so from now on.

Latest revelation is that Campbell Ogilvie, Jim Ballantyne & Donald Findlay all have or had shares in Rangers Football Club.

Thank god there are some real journalists out there.

[Cawston]

<br />For those who don't follow Alex Thomson on the Chanel 4 news website - please do so from now on. <br />Latest revelation is that Campbell Ogilvie, Jim Ballantyne &amp; Donald Findlay all have or had shares in Rangers Football Club. <br />Thank god there are some real journalists out there.<br />

 

Does that really count as a revelation? Two of them were directors for years and the other is a self confessed supporter and former season ticket holder. Thomson is worth reading though (at times).

[Flyerton]

What time do they vote Sevco into the SPL? is the vote today?

 

Edit: Say the SPL vote to allow Newco into SPL today, will the diddy clubs launch a formal protest?

[beermonkey]

What time do they vote Sevco into the SPL? is the vote today?

 

Edit: Say the SPL vote to allow Newco into SPL today, will the diddy clubs launch a formal protest?

Personally, i'd rather the "diddy clubs" permanently refuse any promotion to the SPL if that happens.

 

Tell the SPL we want nothing more to do with them....let them have the closed door league they've always wanted.

 

Bluff calling time.

[Wee Dublin End]

Personally, i'd rather the "diddy clubs" permanently refuse any promotion to the SPL if that happens.

 

Tell the SPL we want nothing more to do with them....let them have the closed door league they've always wanted.

 

Wee Dublin End likes this.

[tom]

Personally, i'd rather the "diddy clubs" permanently refuse any promotion to the SPL if that happens.

 

Tell the SPL we want nothing more to do with them....let them have the closed door league they've always wanted.

 

Bluff calling time.

 

 

The SFA should be telling them to **** off. Next years European reps should come from SFL1. Time to grow a pair!!!!

[irnbru]

Does that really count as a revelation? Two of them were directors for years and the other is a self confessed supporter and former season ticket holder. Thomson is worth reading though (at times).

 

I agree Thomson is worth reading but most of his exclusives are rehashed from old stories or things like this which is almost common knowledge to the extent that it's went unmentioned.

 

A good writer and decent journalist but one who sensationalises old news at times.

[irnbru]

The SFA should be telling them to **** off. Next years European reps should come from SFL1. Time to grow a pair!!!!

 

Yeah I think that would be a good idea - affiliate themselves with the SFA as much as possible (arguably not a good thing) but break away and argue that they are Scotlands main league body. If any SPL teams want to apply to join then they would be welcome to start in the lower leagues.

 

It's probably a bit far fetched but some of the bullying tactics have been unbelievable and the SFL should play them at their own game and create a stand off of sorts. At the end of the day the lower leagues get next to nothing from TV deals, etc anyway so Rangers going out of business wouldn't affect them that much.

 

The rumoured proposal to keep them in the SPL is a bit of a joke too - it would all come about by default if the no vote went ahead as planned.

[SpoonTon]

Theres been a lot of people lapping it up

 

I asked for examples. I've seen some pictures rubbing it in, mainly from celtic fans on facebook, but I'm not sure if you're confusing people's convictions about what is right for Scottish football with twisting the knife.

 

They have a home support of 50000 and an international following, you can't tell me you think Morton should be treated with equality

 

Of course we should be treated with equality! Why shouldn't we? The long term future of Scottish football will be better for treating all clubs equally. What we've been doing in the last 20 years obviously isn't working: 1 world cup appearance, 1 Euro Championship appearance, non-OF clubs in Scotland struggling to compete in the SPL and europe, struggling to bring through enough good young players, mountains of debt (and so on).

 

Everyone and their granny hated Gretna

 

People disliked Gretna because they tried to cheat other clubs through their own financial recklessness. Same with Livi, Dundee, and Rangers. Livi were demoted to division 3 because they couldn't guarentee that they could play through the season, Dundee were deducted 25 points for going in to admin twice, and Gretna didn't get back into the league in any form after being liquidated.

 

Yeah...but we keep our fingers crossed we get an away tie to grab the $$$$ just ask Mr Rae

 

I certainly don't, and I know many fans who feel the same. Rae can see short term financial benefits, but it's hardly make or break for us over the long term, so I hardly think that we should be worrying about what some Rangers fans think of us.

 

But that's what businesses do, they speculate on their future income and invest based on these figures to enable them to compete.

 

What you're talking about is the same irresponsible speculation which has caused financial problem all over the world. They tried to rig the system by having a 1 in 12 relegation. Therefore they could close the doors to anyone else getting that income.

[tom]

Yeah I think that would be a good idea - affiliate themselves with the SFA as much as possible (arguably not a good thing) but break away and argue that they are Scotlands main league body. If any SPL teams want to apply to join then they would be welcome to start in the lower leagues.

 

It's probably a bit far fetched but some of the bullying tactics have been unbelievable and the SFL should play them at their own game and create a stand off of sorts.

The SPL are corrupt. Declare it to UEFA/FIFA and ban the league. If they no longer represent Scotland, they can do what they want. If the sponsors are pulling out, go find other sponsors!! Everything we hear is more and more blatant corruption.