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Tonsilitis

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It seems that the church in Ireland between 1975 and 2004 colluded in covering up for priests with a taste for wee boys. Now that its all come out, the reasons given by the church hierarchy for doing what they did were

 

1) To avoid any scandal which might damage the reputation of the church

2) To protect the church's assets

 

Offending priests were just quietly removed and sent to another diocese where they did it all again. It seems that the church values its reputation and its wealth above their child victims.

 

The Irish government have said that they will prosecute anyone involved, including those who covered it up as well as the paedophiles. They will have to look outside the church for that as it seems successive Irish governments were frightened of tackling it as well (just as we have had successive governments who are frightened to tackle the church on their educational apartheid system!)

 

It just puts the position of the church in stark relief. It is clear its all about power and maintaining their grip over their flock. Nothing is to be allowed to interfere with that.

 

And its not just in Ireland! One of the Irish victims who has largely driven things to the point that the government can't ignore said on the radio tonight that similar things are happening all over the world. He mention sub Saharan Africa, America and, closer to home, in both England and Scotland.

 

I really don't have much time for religion but everyone to their own in that regard. When though, the church conspires to cover up this sort of thing there is something totally rotten at its core. Its a total joke that they then try to tell people how to lead their lives and pontificate about morals!

 

The only question I have as a father is why didn't these kids fathers go round to the chapel and kick the offending priest up and down the aisle?

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Pity that you spoiled a piece with lots of good points by confusing choice and apartheid.

 

 

 

 

 


"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their consciences."

The goal of Socialism is Communism- Lenin

 

Je ne suis pas Marxiste : K Marx

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Pity that you spoiled a piece with lots of good points by confusing choice and apartheid.

 

Forgive him father he has sinned. :rolleyes:

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It seems that the church in Ireland between 1975 and 2004 colluded in covering up for priests with a taste for wee boys. Now that its all come out, the reasons given by the church hierarchy for doing what they did were

 

1) To avoid any scandal which might damage the reputation of the church

2) To protect the church's assets

 

Offending priests were just quietly removed and sent to another diocese where they did it all again. It seems that the church values its reputation and its wealth above their child victims.

 

The Irish government have said that they will prosecute anyone involved, including those who covered it up as well as the paedophiles. They will have to look outside the church for that as it seems successive Irish governments were frightened of tackling it as well (just as we have had successive governments who are frightened to tackle the church on their educational apartheid system!)

 

It just puts the position of the church in stark relief. It is clear its all about power and maintaining their grip over their flock. Nothing is to be allowed to interfere with that.

 

And its not just in Ireland! One of the Irish victims who has largely driven things to the point that the government can't ignore said on the radio tonight that similar things are happening all over the world. He mention sub Saharan Africa, America and, closer to home, in both England and Scotland.

 

I really don't have much time for religion but everyone to their own in that regard. When though, the church conspires to cover up this sort of thing there is something totally rotten at its core. Its a total joke that they then try to tell people how to lead their lives and pontificate about morals!

 

The only question I have as a father is why didn't these kids fathers go round to the chapel and kick the offending priest up and down the aisle?

 

Are they going to take on the vatican heirarchy ?

Its not a joke it is obscene.

If a writer of prose knows enough of what he is writing about he may omit things that he knows and the reader, if the writer is writing truly enough, will have a feeling of those things as strongly as though the writer had stated them. The dignity of movement of an ice-berg is due to only one-eighth of it being above water. A writer who omits things because he does not know them only makes hollow places in his writing.

—Ernest Hemingway

 

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It seems that the church in Ireland between 1975 and 2004 colluded in covering up for priests with a taste for wee boys. Now that its all come out, the reasons given by the church hierarchy for doing what they did were

 

1) To avoid any scandal which might damage the reputation of the church

2) To protect the church's assets

 

Offending priests were just quietly removed and sent to another diocese where they did it all again. It seems that the church values its reputation and its wealth above their child victims.

 

The Irish government have said that they will prosecute anyone involved, including those who covered it up as well as the paedophiles. They will have to look outside the church for that as it seems successive Irish governments were frightened of tackling it as well (just as we have had successive governments who are frightened to tackle the church on their educational apartheid system!)

 

It just puts the position of the church in stark relief. It is clear its all about power and maintaining their grip over their flock. Nothing is to be allowed to interfere with that.

 

And its not just in Ireland! One of the Irish victims who has largely driven things to the point that the government can't ignore said on the radio tonight that similar things are happening all over the world.

 

He mention sub Saharan Africa, America and, closer to home, in both England and Scotland.

 

I really don't have much time for religion but everyone to their own in that regard. When though, the church conspires to cover up this sort of thing there is something totally rotten at its core. Its a total joke that they then try to tell people how to lead their lives and pontificate about morals!

 

The only question I have as a father is why didn't these kids fathers go round to the chapel and kick the offending priest up and down the aisle?

 

 

 

... and in Oz.

 

For example:

 

A tenth man has been charged with sexually assaulting boys at a central western NSW boarding school, police say.

 

Strike Force Belle was established to investigate allegations of sexual assaults on students at two secondary colleges at Bathurst between 1960 and 1993.

 

Some of the alleged offences occurred at the prestigious boys boarding school, St Stanislaus school.

 

Staff including a former principal, vice-principal and chaplain have since been arrested.

 

 

 

http://www.smh.com.au/national/tenth-man-c...91126-js8q.html

 

 

 

 

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Jeezo, Tonsilitis is an antidisestablishmentarianist! :lol:

 

 

That's easy for you to say.

If a writer of prose knows enough of what he is writing about he may omit things that he knows and the reader, if the writer is writing truly enough, will have a feeling of those things as strongly as though the writer had stated them. The dignity of movement of an ice-berg is due to only one-eighth of it being above water. A writer who omits things because he does not know them only makes hollow places in his writing.

—Ernest Hemingway

 

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Forgive him father he has sinned. :rolleyes:

:lol:

The old Mo Johnstone quip.

Bless me father I have signed. :lol:

 

 

Jeezo, Tonsilitis is an antidisestablishmentarianist! :lol:

Au contraire he is an antiantidisestablishmentarianist.

 


"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their consciences."

The goal of Socialism is Communism- Lenin

 

Je ne suis pas Marxiste : K Marx

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Pity that you spoiled a piece with lots of good points by confusing choice and apartheid.

I raise you St Ninians in Giffnock where the school are saying that they take pupils of all denominations whereas the local church hierarchy are insisting that scarce places at the school should be given to Catholics in priority to others. I'm not sure what it is they think the Catholic kids will catch from the rest - maybe a dose of common sense?

 

Its such a shame that the church has brainwashed its flock into the whole 'choice' thing when , really, by any common sense definition it's indefensible in a country which has such a shameful history of sectarianism.

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Its such a shame that the church has brainwashed its flock into the whole 'choice' thing when , really, by any common sense definition it's indefensible in a country which has such a shameful history of sectarianism.

 

:lol:

 

Indeed. The Scottish population engaged in heinous anti-Catholic riots throughout the 18th Century (here in Greenock too), when there were 5000 Catholics in the entire country.

Anyone who thinks the sectarian problem is caused by Catholic schools hasn't consulted Scotland's esteemed track record of bigotry since the religious settlement of 1690.

The site is supposed to be a place for the extended 'family' of Morton supporters - having an affinity with people that you don't know, because you share a love of your local football club. It's not supposed to be about point scoring and showing how 'clever' or 'funny' you are, or just being downright rude and offensive to people you don't know, because you can get away with it. Unfortunately, it seems the classic case of people who have little standing/presence in real life, use this forum as a way of making themselves feel as if they are something. It's sad, and I've said that before..

 

So, having been on Morton forums for about 15 years I guess, I've had enough... well done t*ssers, another Morton supporter driven away. You can all feel happy at how 'clever' you are

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:lol:

 

Indeed. The Scottish population engaged in heinous anti-Catholic riots throughout the 18th Century (here in Greenock too), when there were 5000 Catholics in the entire country.

Anyone who thinks the sectarian problem is caused by Catholic schools hasn't consulted Scotland's esteemed track record of bigotry since the religious settlement of 1690.

 

There is no denying now though that this early separation plays a large part.

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There is no denying now though that this early separation plays a large part.

 

Well, there kinda is.

 

Scotland's sectarian problem was engrained in the national psyche centuries prior to the 1918 Education Act. Why would that be seen as the cause when there's clearly larger elements of identity at play?

The site is supposed to be a place for the extended 'family' of Morton supporters - having an affinity with people that you don't know, because you share a love of your local football club. It's not supposed to be about point scoring and showing how 'clever' or 'funny' you are, or just being downright rude and offensive to people you don't know, because you can get away with it. Unfortunately, it seems the classic case of people who have little standing/presence in real life, use this forum as a way of making themselves feel as if they are something. It's sad, and I've said that before..

 

So, having been on Morton forums for about 15 years I guess, I've had enough... well done t*ssers, another Morton supporter driven away. You can all feel happy at how 'clever' you are

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Damn you VT!!!

 

Numerous other threads you have nearly had me throwing this thing oot the windy with your obnoxious nonsense and now I find myself whoeheartedly agreeing with you.

 

To blame the Catholic Schools for all sectarian problems is far too simplistic and short sighted.

The reason that many Irish immigrants moved to this part of Scotland was to escape being socially, economically, culturally and politically second class citizens in their home land. Once they arrive, they experience the exact same, in many ways worse. In many cases, the RC Church was their local community. Whether one agrees with the schools or not, is not the issue here.

 

The issue is that of state cover up of paedophiles. Diarmid Martin seemed extremely contrite on the issue today.

It is about the Catholic Church now acknowledging the horrors that took place in the past. It is about the Pope visiting ireland and acknowledging the horrors.

20.1.09

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Well, there kinda is.

 

Scotland's sectarian problem was engrained in the national psyche centuries prior to the 1918 Education Act. Why would that be seen as the cause when there's clearly larger elements of identity at play?

 

And therfore this engrained sectarianism is used to justify the fact that this Act should not be eradicated . It encourages those engrained beliefs by the Roman Catholic Church attitude towards not questioning their authority. Why ? Power? Pure and simple.

It is not the cause but is certainly one of many parts of our society which need to be tackled if we are truely to progress as a multi faith multi national humane and caring society it is outdated and simply wrong in my opinion.

If a writer of prose knows enough of what he is writing about he may omit things that he knows and the reader, if the writer is writing truly enough, will have a feeling of those things as strongly as though the writer had stated them. The dignity of movement of an ice-berg is due to only one-eighth of it being above water. A writer who omits things because he does not know them only makes hollow places in his writing.

—Ernest Hemingway

 

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Damn you VT!!!

 

Numerous other threads you have nearly had me throwing this thing oot the windy with your obnoxious nonsense and now I find myself whoeheartedly agreeing with you.

 

To blame the Catholic Schools for all sectarian problems is far too simplistic and short sighted.

The reason that many Irish immigrants moved to this part of Scotland was to escape being socially, economically, culturally and politically second class citizens in their home land. Once they arrive, they experience the exact same, in many ways worse. In many cases, the RC Church was their local community. Whether one agrees with the schools or not, is not the issue here.

 

The issue is that of state cover up of paedophiles. Diarmid Martin seemed extremely contrite on the issue today.

It is about the Catholic Church now acknowledging the horrors that took place in the past. It is about the Pope visiting ireland and acknowledging the horrors.

Well that is awfy kinda of him and so everything in the garden is rosey again. Try acknowledging the Vatican cover up on it as well. See Boston for further details.

If a writer of prose knows enough of what he is writing about he may omit things that he knows and the reader, if the writer is writing truly enough, will have a feeling of those things as strongly as though the writer had stated them. The dignity of movement of an ice-berg is due to only one-eighth of it being above water. A writer who omits things because he does not know them only makes hollow places in his writing.

—Ernest Hemingway

 

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There is no denying now though that this early separation plays a large part.

 

Sorry mate, I'd have to disagree with you about that, my kids go to a Catholic High School in Falkirk. My son is a Morton supporter ( no surprise there ) his 10 best friends are, in no particular order,

 

2 - Partick fans,

2 - Rangers fans,

1 - Everton fan,

3 - Falkirk fans,

2 - Celtic fans.

 

He has no real belief in religion and has more belief in his mates, it's unfortunate, but almost certainly true that this nonsense comes from within the family or local environment, rather than from the school.

 

He has never been seperated from his friends, either by religion or school, but then maybe, he just hasn't been brought up by bigots.

 

You make your own mind up.

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And therfore this engrained sectarianism is used to justify the fact that this Act should not be eradicated . It encourages those engrained beliefs by the Roman Catholic Church attitude towards not questioning their authority. Why ? Power? Pure and simple.

It is not the cause but is certainly one of many parts of our society which need to be tackled if we are truely to progress as a multi faith multi national humane and caring society it is outdated and simply wrong in my opinion.

 

A multi faith society that would not allow a sizeable number of parent to choose their school on the basis of a core ethos, with minimal cost to the greater taxpayer?

And why is this inclusion meme only applicable to Scotland?

 

Let's also not labour under the pretence that so-called non-denominational schools are strictly secular organisations. Both promote their certain slants of Christianity and both can work equally well with each other.

 

I'll happily quote eminent historian Prof. Tom Devine on this one:

 

the 1918 Act had a more positive effect, being in the long run a key factor in the promotion of Catholic assimilation. Without it, the Scoto-Irish may have been unable to grasp the educational opportunities of the twentieth century and as a result be condemned to the status of an underprivileged and alienated minority. Instead, 1918... enabled the eventual growth of a large Catholic professional class, fully integrated into the mainstream of Scottish society.

The site is supposed to be a place for the extended 'family' of Morton supporters - having an affinity with people that you don't know, because you share a love of your local football club. It's not supposed to be about point scoring and showing how 'clever' or 'funny' you are, or just being downright rude and offensive to people you don't know, because you can get away with it. Unfortunately, it seems the classic case of people who have little standing/presence in real life, use this forum as a way of making themselves feel as if they are something. It's sad, and I've said that before..

 

So, having been on Morton forums for about 15 years I guess, I've had enough... well done t*ssers, another Morton supporter driven away. You can all feel happy at how 'clever' you are

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A multi faith society that would not allow a sizeable number of parent to choose their school on the basis of a core ethos, with minimal cost to the greater taxpayer?

And why is this inclusion meme only applicable to Scotland?

 

Let's also not labour under the pretence that so-called non-denominational schools are strictly secular organisations. Both promote their certain slants of Christianity and both can work equally well with each other.

I'll happily quote eminent historian Prof. Tom Devine on this one:

 

1) What would be the cost be to the Catholic Church

2)No it isn't

3)No they don't

4) No he isn't

If a writer of prose knows enough of what he is writing about he may omit things that he knows and the reader, if the writer is writing truly enough, will have a feeling of those things as strongly as though the writer had stated them. The dignity of movement of an ice-berg is due to only one-eighth of it being above water. A writer who omits things because he does not know them only makes hollow places in his writing.

—Ernest Hemingway

 

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El Gofer is right in that the principal theme of this thread is sickening attitude of the church to paedophile priests. I hope they all get their come uppence and the Bishops who presided over the cover up feel the full force of the law.

 

As for the influence of sectarian schools on sectarianism, no right thinking person can deny that it is not there. At no stage have I said I believe they are the original cause of it but we have to deal with the here and now and they do have a role in maintaining sectarianism. Whilst there are any number of other factors, their abolition and a move to schools organised and strictly secular grounds would be, in my opinion, a major step forward in addressing sectarianism.

 

I can fully accept that many will not share my view but for every one who does not, I suspect there will be one, maybe more, who does. Its a scandal that we allow our kids to be segregated along religious lines in this day and age.

 

Still its not as big a scandal as they have in Ireland, especially those governments who knew what was going on and chose to subrogate their responsibility to look after their citizens to their fear of Rome.

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1) What would be the cost be to the Catholic Church

2)No it isn't

3)No they don't

4) No he isn't

 

1. Catholic schools were brought from voluntary support into the state system.

 

2. Well it is. Faith-based schools are prevalent in the US and Europe but no-one there is whingeing about promoting divisions. People accept that friends are as likely to be made in the neighbourhood and youth organisations as in school, and get over their own narrow-minded views of society.

 

3. Non-denominational schools have a long-established track record of bringing in Church of Scotland ministers, services etc. I think I'm right in recalling nacho complainign about his religious mistreatment at the hands of the Godly establishment.

 

4. Tom Devine is by far and away the most pre-eminent, respected and knowledgeable figure when it comes to domestic Scottish history. That he doesn't apply your own narrow-minded agendas to the facts shows that you're wrong rather than he's lost it.

The site is supposed to be a place for the extended 'family' of Morton supporters - having an affinity with people that you don't know, because you share a love of your local football club. It's not supposed to be about point scoring and showing how 'clever' or 'funny' you are, or just being downright rude and offensive to people you don't know, because you can get away with it. Unfortunately, it seems the classic case of people who have little standing/presence in real life, use this forum as a way of making themselves feel as if they are something. It's sad, and I've said that before..

 

So, having been on Morton forums for about 15 years I guess, I've had enough... well done t*ssers, another Morton supporter driven away. You can all feel happy at how 'clever' you are

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